[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Mordor Suggestions

Easterlings and Haradrim Allies

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Morgul Orc:
I thought of an Idea for Easterlings and Haradrim Allies in relation with the Ring wraiths.

The idea is that Allies increase in numbers when called if certain ring wraiths are more powerful in 3 stages,

For example when you call the Easterlings only 2 battalions arrive but when you have Khamul in play and call Easterlings there will be 4 battalions, when Khamul has "Insignius of the Liutenant" purchased there will be 6 battalions.

As for Haradrim, I think that the Cavalry are unnecessary, I think Mumakils with Haradrim archers is enough.

But the example is similar to the Haradrim allies except maybe the allies increase when Ji Indur Dawndeath is more powerful.

I also think that it would be great to add the audio voice of the Soldiers of Rhun from bfme 1 for the Rhun Halberdier warriors.

hoho96:
The influences of Sauron used to do similar effect  (increase the number of reinforcements) but it was taken out I think because of balance issues.
However I agree there should be more depth to Evil men without making them 2OP (6 battalions ftw?!). Especially taking into consideration that mordor is all about larg numbers of Orcs and they don't need Evil Men for even greater numbers, but rather to fill up some weaknesses in Mordor's build (heavy soldiers and cavalry).

Why would you remove the cavalry from the Haradrim? ! It makes no sense O_o in the lore, the Haradrim were the main cavalry force for mordor (beside providing the Mumakils).

Btw Ji Indur is not canon. And if you noticed, the only named Nazgul in Edain (and in the whole lore) is Khamul.

goat stealer:
I also think that the evil men more or less got the short end of the stick, which makes me sad to say as this is pretty much one of the few issues that I have with Mordor.

I can understand how increasing the number of reinforcement sent could be problematic but as it is now, where players are waiting for quite a while for a single battalion of two kinds of units, there's not much reason to use Easterlings and Haradrim when it's more time efficient and ultimately better to spend resources on the alternatives.

Why wait for a single battalion of Easterling pikemen and halberdiers when I can pump out 5 hordes of orc warriors and pikement instead? (A situation which gets even more one sided if Morgul/Guldur orcs are available) Need Calvary? There are always Morgul knights or the Black Riders. Mumakil? That can more or less be replicated with enough Trolls.

Maybe the intent behind this restriction is that orcs are supposed to be the backbone of Sauron's forces while the evil men are supplements. It's an idea I can get behind but if the restrictions on them are so great and the roles they offer aren't worth putting up with said restrictions and can even be matched/outmatched by alternatives that are more readily available, then what's the point?

Makes me wish that the evil men were their own factions so they could have the proper elbow room to expand. Or alternatively: Make it so players can use Outposts to build structures from which they can recruit evil men akin to a Morgul/Guldur fortress in which a Haradrim fortress can you Haradrim cavalry, Mumakil, and archers while an Easterling fortress can get you Easterling Pikemen, Halberdiers, and Corsairs while making them pricier in terms of resources and command points. As for influence ideas, maybe make it so they unlock upgrades but extra resources will have to be spent for each battalion.

Sure, orcs should be Sauron's main fighting force, but I don't think that it should mean that the evil men have to be overshadowed to the point of obsolescence.

Morgul Orc:

--- Zitat von: hoho96 am 27. Apr 2015, 08:20 ---The influences of Sauron used to do similar effect  (increase the number of reinforcements) but it was taken out I think because of balance issues.
However I agree there should be more depth to Evil men without making them 2OP (6 battalions ftw?!). Especially taking into consideration that mordor is all about larg numbers of Orcs and they don't need Evil Men for even greater numbers, but rather to fill up some weaknesses in Mordor's build (heavy soldiers and cavalry).

Why would you remove the cavalry from the Haradrim? ! It makes no sense O_o in the lore, the Haradrim were the main cavalry force for mordor (beside providing the Mumakils).

Btw Ji Indur is not canon. And if you noticed, the only named Nazgul in Edain (and in the whole lore) is Khamul.

--- Ende Zitat ---
I guess I exaggerated about the number of battalions  :D   

I am thinking about the issue of calling the allies and they are limited in arriving near camp, maybe better to have a command similar to summon so you can summon anywhere instead of letting them walk all the way to the area where your units are attacking etc.


--- Zitat von: goat stealer am 28. Apr 2015, 01:37 ---I also think that the evil men more or less got the short end of the stick, which makes me sad to say as this is pretty much one of the few issues that I have with Mordor.

I can understand how increasing the number of reinforcement sent could be problematic but as it is now, where players are waiting for quite a while for a single battalion of two kinds of units, there's not much reason to use Easterlings and Haradrim when it's more time efficient and ultimately better to spend resources on the alternatives.

Why wait for a single battalion of Easterling pikemen and halberdiers when I can pump out 5 hordes of orc warriors and pikement instead? (A situation which gets even more one sided if Morgul/Guldur orcs are available) Need Calvary? There are always Morgul knights or the Black Riders. Mumakil? That can more or less be replicated with enough Trolls.

Maybe the intent behind this restriction is that orcs are supposed to be the backbone of Sauron's forces while the evil men are supplements. It's an idea I can get behind but if the restrictions on them are so great and the roles they offer aren't worth putting up with said restrictions and can even be matched/outmatched by alternatives that are more readily available, then what's the point?

Makes me wish that the evil men were their own factions so they could have the proper elbow room to expand. Or alternatively: Make it so players can use Outposts to build structures from which they can recruit evil men akin to a Morgul/Guldur fortress in which a Haradrim fortress can you Haradrim cavalry, Mumakil, and archers while an Easterling fortress can get you Easterling Pikemen, Halberdiers, and Corsairs while making them pricier in terms of resources and command points. As for influence ideas, maybe make it so they unlock upgrades but extra resources will have to be spent for each battalion.

Sure, orcs should be Sauron's main fighting force, but I don't think that it should mean that the evil men have to be overshadowed to the point of obsolescence.

--- Ende Zitat ---
I think it's a great idea to make Evil men a faction, but will they be 2 separate factions, Harad and Rhun?

I don't think it's a good idea to have buildings for Rhun and Harad in the Outpost that will be a little selfish of us Mordor fans  :D

I do agree that the recharge time takes a little long specially for Haradrim allies

Maybe the power of of calling allies from Rhun and Harad should require more power points, it would make sense then if they came in larger numbers.

I also think the Corsairs of umbar need to have a role in play,
maybe called in maps with seas in their ships?

hoho96:
recharge time on the spells can greatly be decreased by building tribute camps (the resource building).
If they were made to be summoned anywhere on the map (like other factions summons) then they will have a time limit. Now here's the advantage of Mordor; you can just keep summoning Evil Men without any number limit (aside from CP). You say you can fill up their roles with other units? other units needs resources to be spent on, but since evil men are in the spellbook, they're relatively free! Esterlings are also quite powerful when used right, especially with formation, and Saurons influence gives them even heavier armor (but of course they can't be made tower-guards-elite-ish). Mumakils are the only unit in the game that can just walk on cavalry. also they've got a great attack vs buildings so in a way you also get an awesome siege weapon (rather than spending on siegeworks and invest heavily in catapults and rams).
oh an Morgul riders as cavalry is immensely expensive not only in resources but also in CP (120 for a single battalion!!) now when you compare this with other factions, you can clearly see how Mordor lags behind in terms of cavalry, and how Haradrim are the most feasible option.

Still it's not the most perfect system, but we need viable suggestion not just "make them a whole new faction" (which btw is a very likely, yet unconfirmed, suggestion for the far future).

and you got it; the main concept of Mordor is the reliance on masses of Orcs, and they already got try different types of outposts to choose from, so putting evil men on an outpost is also highly unlikely.

Maybe something related to Saurons influence? Like cumulative  on evil men when casting the influence on different buildings?
Maybe the tribute camp can a single extra special unit (maybe some of the scrapped units, or even a hero) and the armory can get evil men better equipment (all the while still doing the previous bonuses).
just throwing some ideas  xD

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