Imlardis revamp suggestion

[Feanaro]

Mae Govannen and well met

I have a suggestion for Imlardis faction which was my favorite in older version of Edain mod.

Here are the facts that were stated in Silmarillion

High Elves and Elves of First age ( Noldo, Vanyar ) were the most powerful and most feared of any race/faction against Dark Foe of the World , Morgoth. Keep in mind that Sauron was just his puppet. Elves in general posses superior strength,stamina , they are wisest and they do not suffer illness.

Along with that they have centuris , some ages of combat experience which can make them nearly perfect.

Names like Maedhros,Fingon,Finglofin,Curufin,Turgon,Finrod are legendary. Imlardis are direct descendants of Noldo, but very few of them left in Middle-Earth.

They have the blood of Firstborn in their prime and I honestly think you should make them the best overall units in game, but without making them super overpowered to break balance.

Nevertheless they should have highest damage and highest quality armor ( next to dwarves ) We know that dwarven and Elven armor are of the highest quality, Elf smiths Celebrimor and Feanor are 2 most renowned ever and Dwarven Mithirl mail is incredibly strong indeed.

Or Give them unique abilites which will not be avilable to any other faction like passive ability to reduce enemy armor/dmg, fear immunity, inspiration to other troops and ability to give major experience to others.

I loved the way you introduced Imlarids faction in 3.8.1 but I have some other suggestions regarding units.

Imlarids faction should be played carefuly and with use of tactics due to fact they have low units per group and takes longest time to reach maximum potential.

All units have fear immunity since start, no additional level required.

All units start with max level  and upgrades.

5 per unit max. They are very powerful.

Increase built time, Increase cost.

Power of the Eldar and Firstborn - Very high poison resist , we know that elves do not suffer illness and are very resistant to it

Rivendell Archer - 30% Range and attack was too overpowered. It should be reduced to 15% -20% max.

Increase the armor furthermore , but reduce their speed. Slightly decrease attack speed.

Rivendell swordsman / Passive ability Blade storm , temp boost to attack damage while slowly draining HP. If they survive the fight, they regen again.

Rivendell lancer - Mental fortitude - passive ability. Cannot be knocked down by cavarly , only large monsters like Trolls or Mumaks, dragons, etc..

Slighty decrease their HP. Increase Armor.

Improve defence against trample damage and cavarly esp Mordor cavarly ( Morgul something I forgot their name )

Lancer is weak to swordsman , not cavarly or archers.

Rivendell Champion , My favorite unit. 2nd deadliest imo it should be. Elite infantry

Upgrade ability -Fury of blades , Double the attack speed for short duration, can hit 2 enemies

Upgrade ability - Wrath of Orome  - Enemy infanty flees in terror  for short duration, but cannot be attacked for 10 - 15 sec

Passive ability to Champion. Blood/Dying rage - Boost to attack damage when health is lower then 30%/15%  30/50%

Master infantry

Watchdog of Imlarids - PLEASE rename it, its silly name watchdogs for Elves.

Rename suggestions

Vanquishers,Immortals,Shadow slayers,Noldo veterans..

Best of the best troops, veterains of countless battles, dressed in white or red, Huge HP , Very high damage, high armor, medium speed.

Passive ability Inspiration buff, You presence inspire others , +25% damage and 25% armor bonus for other infantry

Passive abilty - Invincible , ( name ) will fight when HP is drained for 7 sec.

Upgrade option N1 - Raging Frenzy -Boosts attack damage based on overall HP

100 -80/60/40/20        - 20%/40%/60%/80%

Upgrade option ( Wisdom of the ancients ) Dual wield option , Two handed option

Dual wield - Increases attack speed by 30%  can hit second target with 50% less damage

Two handed option 20% damage 25% chance to paralyze enemy  target for 3 sec All except heroes and very large monsters.

Upgrade option N3

Blessing of Eonwe - Targeted infantry receives bonus damage against Heroes

+20% damage against enemy hero.

Note: You can only have 1 upgrade ability so choose wiserly.

3 max units avilable to build.


I'll update soon more! Hope you like some of it !

[Linhir]

I couldn't find better topic for this, so I'll write it here.
I've got one question, there will be Durin IV and some dwarves in Imladris Last Alliance spell?

[LordDainIronfoot]

Well I have made that suggestion directly to Earendil!I suggested few weeks ago that there should be some Dwarves led by Durin IV in the Last Alliance Spell but he simply said that they can do it but do not want to! Even though it is lore true that there should be Dwarves sicne the Movie didn't show them the Team do not want to do it too ! Which makes the Dwarves look like "dicks" for not joining the free people against Sauron while in truth they sended great host led by Durin IV himself! But as I said the Team refused completely!
P.S. Sorry for going out of topic!

[TiberiusOgden]

Well I have made that suggestion directly to Earendil!I suggested few weeks ago that there should be some Dwarves led by Durin IV in the Last Alliance Spell but he simply said that they can do it but do not want to!

And I agree with Ea.

• In that case there would be too many heroes and units even for ultimate spell
• Movie feeling will be gone, yes, Dwarves also participated, but that spell is nice reference to prologue from the Fellowship of the ring.
• Some dwarven heroes will be in the spellbook as well (Elrond's council spell)
• Dwarves don't like Elves

[Linhir]

Yeah, they don't like them so much, that in LA fought about 50000 dwarves. 

[Walküre]

Well I have made that suggestion directly to Earendil!I suggested few weeks ago that there should be some Dwarves led by Durin IV in the Last Alliance Spell but he simply said that they can do it but do not want to!

And I agree with Ea.

• In that case there would be too many heroes and units even for ultimate spell
• Movie feeling will be gone, yes, Dwarves also participated, but that spell is nice reference to prologue from the Fellowship of the ring.
• Some dwarven heroes will be in the spellbook as well (Elrond's council spell)
• Dwarves don't like Elves

I too agree with Ea and Tiberius, Dáin 

Not only does the Last Alliance spell refer to the War of the Last Alliance itself and the cinematographic adaptation, but also it's a spell mainly based on the last act of this War, the Siege of Barad-dûr and the duel with Sauron, where Gil-galad and Elendil tragically died.
The 'main characters' of this spell must thus necessarily be the High King of the Noldor and the Sons of Númenor; the presence of the Dwarves, though lore accurate could be, would not fit very well.

[LordDainIronfoot]

I cant agree with you guys this time! Elves not loving Dwarves is irrelevant since we all know about the good relationship between the Dwarves of Khazad Dum and Eregion and how Durin III gas led and Army to help them against Sauron but arrived too late!
And I cant agree leaving Dwarves out just because it will not be like in thw Movie and the focus must be only on thw beloved Elves amd the great Man leaving Dwarves out this time ia near a "racism" !Just for the sake of Man and Elves to more hype and get all the glory as always! :-) Plus the only hero that the Dwarves will have is Durin IV who can usr Dains old Model with some changes while.the Dwarves can be with old veteran skins! :-)
P.S. And as you can see even in the final act at rhe Siege of Barad Dur there were a Dwarven Army http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Siege%20of%20Barad-d%C3%BBr

[Walküre]

I cant agree with you guys this time! Elves not loving Dwarves is irrelevant since we all know about the good relationship between the Dwarves of Khazad Dum and Eregion and how Durin III gas led and Army to help them against Sauron but arrived too late!
And I cant agree leaving Dwarves out just because it will not be like in thw Movie and the focus must be only on thw beloved Elves amd the great Man leaving Dwarves out this time ia near a "racism" !Just for the sake of Man and Elves to more hype and get all the glory as always! :-) Plus the only hero that the Dwarves will have is Durin IV who can usr Dains old Model with some changes while.the Dwarves can be with old veteran skins! :-)

In fact, in my reply, I never mentioned any type of bad relationships between Elves and Dwarves.
Elves and Dwarves, although some serious 'incidents', have always had good and useful ties since the Years of the Trees, when Middle Earth was dark under a starry Sky, and the only Light dwelt beyond the Pelóri Mountains 

Anyway, the Last Alliance spell is precisely conceived to meet those precise standards, the Dwarves would be out of place 

[LordDainIronfoot]

Tiberius said about Dwarves nor loving Elves
Still I do not understand why thw Dwarves would be out of place!?If that was the case I think that Tolkien himself wouldn't have included them there!While he wanted to show that Dwarves arw not so isolated and selfish to not care about the Darkness that descends !

[Walküre]

Tiberius said about Dwarves nor loving Elves
Still I do not understand why thw Dwarves would be out of place!?If that was the case I think that Tolkien himself wouldn't have included them there!While he wanted to show that Dwarves arw not so isolated and selfish to not care about the Darkness that descends !

The Dwarves didn't have a relevant role in the final duel against the Dark Lord, at the feet of his fortress, after years of siege.

In that precise moment, Gil-galad, Elendil and Isildur became part of the LEGEND 

[LordDainIronfoot]

It is not about the Heroes it is a global War in which Dwarves helped!It is not about single heroes against Sauron but a war !Leta see Isildur ,Gil Galad and Elendil defeat the whole Armies of Sauron bu themselves!? The Last Alliance is not about a duel between Good Heroes against Sauron but to represent the joined forces of thw free people Dwarves,Elves and Man against a comon and global enemy and it is a fact that Dwarves helped with quite an Army consisted of the Noblest of the Dwarves the Longbeards of Khazad Dum heirs of.Durin and led directly by Durin IV himself! :-)

[Walküre]

It is not about the Heroes it is a global War in which Dwarves helped!It is not about single heroes against Sauron but a war !Leta see Isildur ,Gil Galad and Elendil defeat the whole Armies of Sauron bu themselves!? The Last Alliance is not about a duel between Good Heroes against Sauron but to represent the joined forces of thw free people Dwarves,Elves and Man against a comon and global enemy and it is a fact that Dwarves helped with quite an Army consisted of the Noblest of the Dwarves the Longbeards of Khazad Dum heirs of.Durin and led directly by Durin IV himself! :-)

But that is the way this spell was conceived, helped also by the cinematographic adaptation 

The War of the Last Alliance was indeed wider and destructive, but the final duel with Sauron is definitely, in the lore and in the Tales of Middle Earth, the most crucial and tragic moment.

The Two Númenórean Kingdoms in exile lost their King (Elendil) and his son Anárion; and the Noldor lost their last High King, remnant of a great Glory since the First Age and the Years of the Trees, and they will never regain their past Power.

[LordDainIronfoot]

While I see your point I still have to say that all that sis not right for the spell.!If we follow that logic then we should have a Spell where we summon only Elendil ,Gil Galad ,Isildur and Anarion ! :-) No,simply the Last Alliance Spell should represent the global war and the uniting of the free people amd among.those Armies rhere is a great Host of Dwarves and they deserve a place among those Armies in the Spell! :-)

[Linhir]

In fact, Anarion shouldn't be included! He dies before the duel with sauron, crushed by rock, during siege.

[Walküre]

In fact, Anarion shouldn't be included! He dies before the duel with sauron, crushed by rock, during siege.

But he took part anyway in the final Siege of Sauron's Dark Fortress, along with the Noldor guided by Gil-galad and his herald Elrond.

As you may know, not only the Dwarves were present in the previous battles of the War, but also troops from Lórien, guided by Amdír, and troops from Mirkwood, guided by Oropher, Thranduil's father.
Do they all have to be included?
I think they don't, lest the spell become OP and a bit confusing, losing its LOTR trilogy's references.
And the cinematographic prologue of LOTR is definitely one of the most famous and iconic elements of this trilogy.

[hoho96]

Could you guys please get back to topic.
Except the starting post, no one of you have said anything at all that link even remotely to the topic itself.

Please start a different thread about the last alliance spell if you wish.
All non-related posts will be removed from here in due time.
Thx for the understanding.

[LordDainIronfoot]

I see hoho but we really has gotten out of topic.and I am sorry for that
And still Walkure the main point is to have an Last Alliance Spell which represents all Races ,not all Kingdom and we have Elves and Man why not and Dwarves since we know they were there!? :-)

[Walküre]

Could you guys please get back to topic.
Except the starting post, no one of you have said anything at all that link even remotely to the topic itself.

Please start a different thread about the last alliance spell if you wish.
All non-related posts will be removed from here in due time.
Thx for the understanding.

I'm sorry, hoho96, but I don't agree with you.

We have answered to Linhir's suggestion/proposal, and started then a discussion; I regard it possible and acceptable if the initial topic of the thread (if it isn't a direct and specific question) opens up to a wider general discussion, and, since the topic of this thread is 'Imladris suggestion', I personally find it perfectly legitimate 
Linhir made a further proposal about the Last Alliance spell, which rightly belongs to Imladris as a faction, we then have answered and started discussing about it.

If the topic gets righteously wider (without any really off-topic posts), I don't see how we are doing something against the rules if we discuss it; and and I don't think it is necessary to start another thread about the Last Alliance spell.
If you want to join a thread/discussion you don't necessarily have to always answer or refer to the very first post/topic of that precise thread; if we adopted this method, I think we should delete half of the comments of the 'Elrond, Lord of Imladris' thread or others more.

[LordDainIronfoot]

I support Walkure 100% we are simply widering the question asked by Lihnir and making a good reasonable and polite discussion!I do not think it should be ended ! :-)

[Linhir]

So do I! Just chill a little hoho, and join us or leave in peace. It's idiotic to use regulations selectively. Or it covers all forum, even german, or nothing.

[NetoD20]

Rivendell Archer - 30% Range and attack was too overpowered. It should be reduced to 15% -20% max.

Stop nerfing archers, PLEASE, I can't take this anymore! I like a nice, long, defense-oriented game, and although Edain Mod is amazing it is making very hard to further my playstyle.

Speaking of archers, I remember reading on an old Imladris update post on ModDB that the elite archers of Imladris would be the Dunedáin rangers. While I agree they should be included in the faction somehow, it's really frustrating that the units who are going to take a major role in the faction aren't actually Noldo.

Come on, I love this faction because I love elves, and the heavy bright armours, the arcane magic, and the magnificence of them. Ragged rangers don't fit it. They could be included along with Aragorn ranger version as one of Arwen's spells. But please make the elite archers of this faction actually elven.

Another suggestion is that it would be nice if Imladris' outpost were a Lindon fortress where you can recruit Círdan instead of a simple settlement tower, as of now I don't think Imladris has an outpost, and it would be a real shame not getting one like Rohan. Also, what about giving the Lindon Warriors the ability to switch between bow and two swords instead of one? Every time I clicked switch in Eain 3.8.1 I kind of expected for them to draw two swords and always forgot they had only one (because of the switch button drawing). It would set them apart and it always remind me that in D&D you need high Dexterity both to use bows and fight with two weapons.


Instead of Arwen's the rangers could be a Eladan/Elrohir ability, or a ability of Arwen's summoned Aragorn. Either way Imladris didn't need recruiting them in 3.8.1

[Walküre]

Another suggestion is that it would be nice if Imladris' outpost were a Lindon fortress where you can recruit Círdan instead of a simple settlement tower, as of now I don't think Imladris has an outpost, and it would be a real shame not getting one like Rohan.

I don't totally find the Lindon Tower so out of place; I think that it is, especially for its unique 'upgrading' system connected to Círdan's level, one of the most interesting and useful solutions in the game.

Also, most importantly, in the late Third Age the ancient realm of Lindon has basically disappeared from the World, being still present as very few small settlements along the Western Coast; the overall 'military' and 'geopolitical' power of the Grey Havens/Lindon (Círdan) is less relevant and influent even than the one of Rivendell, since the Grey Havens are essentially, at that time, a momentary shelter for the Elves who were willing to leave forever the World.
Giving Lindon an outpost on its own, and new elements concerning warfare, wouldn't be logical and lore accurate, I guess.

[NetoD20]

don't totally find the Lindon Tower so out of place;

Oh, I don't think it's out of place, just that it could be an outpost, but I see your lore point there.

My fear is Imladris not getting an outpost beyond the vanilla one just like Rohan, or getting Arnor's boring Border Fortress. I wanted to see something grand and beautiful, as it is my favourite faction.

[Walküre]

My fear is Imladris not getting an outpost beyond the vanilla one just like Rohan, or getting Arnor's boring Border Fortress. I wanted to see something grand and beautiful, as it is my favourite faction.

I understand your concern.
A possible concept of an outpost for Rivendell, though, is really problematic.
Theoretically, Rivendell can count on various alliances and friendly ties all over Middle Earth (primarily on Arnor/Gondor), via the legendary and sensational bloodline of Elrond (and his twin brother).

But, strictly referring to the geographical position of Imladris, it can't count on anyone but the Rangers of the North and the Hobbits, since Eriador gradually turned in a wild and dangerous land after the Second Age, and Rivendell is a quite isolated place by its nature, being it a magical Elven Shelter protected by one the Three Rings (Vilya).

[Fine]

Currently, Imladris has one option when selecting an outpost plot: the Dúnedain-Outpost. They cannot construct a "vanilla" (imladris) outpost, unlike Rohan. The Dúnedain outpost has four expansion plots (irrc) and allows the training of Dúnedain units (Bow, Spear and Sword) who are cheaper but not better than the regular Imladris units. They get a stealth bonus, though.

Also, I think it would be better to wait until you can actually play as Imladris before discussing changes, not having seen it in its current form.

[Darkslayer]

Well I have made that suggestion directly to Earendil!I suggested few weeks ago that there should be some Dwarves led by Durin IV in the Last Alliance Spell but he simply said that they can do it but do not want to! Even though it is lore true that there should be Dwarves sicne the Movie didn't show them the Team do not want to do it too ! Which makes the Dwarves look like "dicks" for not joining the free people against Sauron while in truth they sended great host led by Durin IV himself! But as I said the Team refused completely!
P.S. Sorry for going out of topic!

You are right, there were Dwarves in the Last Alliance. but remember, according to the Silmarillion, not many Dwarves fought on either side. But yes I do agree it would be cool to see them.

The Last Alliance is to me what the Dwarves are to you, haha 

[Sir_Stig]

Well the Numenoreans were known for their powerful steel bows, so I'm okay with Imladris archers not having the same range as the Dunedáin rangers, as long as they are stronger in close range.

Stop nerfing archers, PLEASE, I can't take this anymore! I like a nice, long, defense-oriented game, and although Edain Mod is amazing it is making very hard to further my playstyle.

Speaking of archers, I remember reading on an old Imladris update post on ModDB that the elite archers of Imladris would be the Dunedáin rangers. While I agree they should be included in the faction somehow, it's really frustrating that the units who are going to take a major role in the faction aren't actually Noldo.

Come on, I love this faction because I love elves, and the heavy bright armours, the arcane magic, and the magnificence of them. Ragged rangers don't fit it. They could be included along with Aragorn ranger version as one of Arwen's spells. But please make the elite archers of this faction actually elven.

Another suggestion is that it would be nice if Imladris' outpost were a Lindon fortress where you can recruit Círdan instead of a simple settlement tower, as of now I don't think Imladris has an outpost, and it would be a real shame not getting one like Rohan. Also, what about giving the Lindon Warriors the ability to switch between bow and two swords instead of one? Every time I clicked switch in Eain 3.8.1 I kind of expected for them to draw two swords and always forgot they had only one (because of the switch button drawing). It would set them apart and it always remind me that in D&D you need high Dexterity both to use bows and fight with two weapons.


Instead of Arwen's the rangers could be a Eladan/Elrohir ability, or a ability of Arwen's summoned Aragorn. Either way Imladris didn't need recruiting them in 3.8.1

[Walküre]

Well the Numenoreans were known for their powerful steel bows, so I'm okay with Imladris archers not having the same range as the Dunedáin rangers, as long as they are stronger in close range.

I think that the Noldorin archers will focus mainly on defence (heavy armour) and endurance, like almost every unit of Rivendell; the main iconic characteristic of this faction will exactly be Quality