[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Imladris Suggestions

Elrond - Lord of Imladris

<< < (19/75) > >>

Gandalf The Gray:
i like that :)

Walküre:

--- Zitat von: Eldalf am 18. Jul 2015, 09:26 ---
There is some lore of her casting down the walls of Dol Guldor, but that would suggest more than anything an anti-magic spell, as it was known that the walls of the great fortresses were held up as much by enchantment as by stone. Furthermore, someone was talking about Gandalf's word of power as iconic from the games, well That is what the tornado is for Elrond

So I ask, what the hell does Elrond's flood in it's current format add to the of Elrond? Go beyond your Galadrial fetish, and consider what does it add?


There is however a significant element of iconism in the tornado spell. It has always been a staple of Elrond in the BFME game series, and to remove it from him would in some respect be like taking word of power from Gandalf. That said, I do not agree with word of power for gandalf even existing, but it is an argument worth considering. If other heroes have powers for the sake of being "Iconic" then should not the same reasoning be applied here.

We can even apply that to Galadrial, from when do we derive this argument of Galadrial wielding the power of the storm if not from BFME and it's imagery? Nothing in the writing of Tolkien alludes to her as being the Storm Queen, except the use of allegory in the mirror sequence.

Anyway that is my couple of primary concerns. Thematically, it is not sufficient to say that Elrond was not capable of sorcery, it is clear that within the boarders of Imaldris he much like Galadrial with Lothlorien was the primary defensive mechanism. Unlike the woodland realm, it is clear that the Golden wood and Rivendell were both protected by enchantments.



--- Ende Zitat ---


You wrote really great lines about the nature of Magic in Tolkien and the particularity of Lothlórien as a 'magically' protected realm (and these aspects will be kind of represented in the Edain Mod), and I totally agree with you.
But there is also something more to add, and I will try not to exceed in boring lore facts stating, also because I feel I have written on MU a ton of posts about this topic.

- No one has ever fetishised or is fetishising Galadriel, since her incredible Might and Importance in Middle Earth's affairs are often hinted at and explained by Tolkien; and, trust me, LOTR and the Silmarillion already give you in their entirety really solid facts and absolute statements about her, as a character and a hero.

- It's true, in the books it is never clearly explained how Galadriel has destroyed Dol Guldur, or what kind of devices she used in her action.
BUT it is easily comprehensible, and the BFME2/Edain Mod solution (whirlwind and storm) is honestly the most reasonable among all the other probabilities; not to mention that the 'relationship' between Galadriel and Storms has always been an iconic element from the very BFME2.
Also, it is fundamental reporting that Galadriel not only did she throw down the Walls of Dol Guldur (and she could have probably used, as you mentioned, a spell that nullified the magical boundaries of the fortress' structures, resembling what Lúthien did in the First Age), but it is also stated that she violently cleansed the fortress and all the surrounding woods by Sauron's memory and the filth of all the evil presences that had been there for centuries, and a Storm is the most immediate and logical way that I can picture in mind.
The MOST REASONABLE explanation that I can give you, of Galadriel's ability involving storms, is the very deep conception of MAGIC of Tolkien.
The elements that you mentioned are crucial, being also the quite exact and 'reflected' thing that happens in Valinor, and the source of the Bliss of this realm (the presence of the Valar).
But, there is something more; another fundamental representation and display of Magic is the ability, of powerful beings, of modifying and manipulating the Weather of the World on a larger scale, according to their will.
And Galadriel and Sauron (the two most powerful beings in Middle Earth in the Third Age) do it all the time, the latter creating an eternal dark Sky of ashes upon Mordor, and the former maintaining a neverending calm and sunny Sky upon Lothlórien; Galadriel, also, long before the War of the Ring, created an enchanted Mist to protect Eorl, the ancestor of the Rohirrim, and his army from the dark influence of Dol Guldur.
Thus, given these essential facts, the ability of Galadriel of conjuring whirlwinds/storms, as also Adrigabbro wrote, can totally be regarded as lore acceptable and iconic  :)

- I think that the problem with Elrond and whirlwinds consists, apart from the lore problematics, in his role as a Hero/Units Supporter.
Galadriel's primary attack against structures (whirlwind) and Gandalf's 'Word of Power' are totally justified by their roles as, respectively, Building Destroyer and Mass Slayer; Galadriel is also a Hero Supporter, and that's why her ultimate level 10 power (Nenya) will focus on Protection.
Given Elrond's role as a supporter hero, he thus should have the healing/restoration powers of Vilya (extended also to the Allies) as his level 10 power, and his flood power would be enough for his role and nature.
A whirlwind as an ability of his, also placed as a level 10 power, doesn't just fit.

TiberiusOgden:
I've talked with Tienety about it ... quite a lot. xD
And it seems that we have, or we will have some interesting proposal for Elrond, which we will suggest together.
During next days I'll present it.

Eldalf:
The reason I would put the flood as a level 10 power is to justify increasing it's power. Elrond's use of the Bruinen is one of the most powerful direct applications of
"magic" in the entire series. Comparable easily to how Galadrial destroys an army of orcs during the march of Erol with a Golden Mist. Thus should it not be something memorable in the game? Let it be the pinnacle of his power, a power that would collapse an army flank entirely, how is that not support?

Walküre:

--- Zitat von: Eldalf am 19. Jul 2015, 03:37 ---The reason I would put the flood as a level 10 power is to justify increasing it's power. Elrond's use of the Bruinen is one of the most powerful direct applications of
"magic" in the entire series. Comparable easily to how Galadrial destroys an army of orcs during the march of Erol with a Golden Mist. Thus should it not be something memorable in the game? Let it be the pinnacle of his power, a power that would collapse an army flank entirely, how is that not support?

--- Ende Zitat ---

Ok, even though I would prefer more Vilya's powers of healing/restoration to be his ultimate power, I can accept the concept of the flood (as I also kept on writing in my comments) as his destructive power; I just don't like the idea of him capable of conjuring whirlwinds, and tying this power to Vilya, as it happened in the Edain Mod 3.8.1.

My mentioning of the significant aid of Galadriel to Eorl and his army was mainly meant to show that it is possible, and very lore accurate, inferring that she has the capability of modifying and manipulating the Weather of the World, and its meteorological phenomena.
But Galadriel's aid to Eorl is clearly not the most important manifestation of her usage of Magic in the Third Age.
Elrond created a flood to defeat the 9 Ringwraiths; Galadriel repulsed three heavy and consecutive assaults from Dol Guldur, and then personally destroyed the fortress and cleansed entirely southern Mirkwood from centuries of evil, making grow a Mallorn Tree on its purified soil.
The display of Galadriel's Magic and powers is honestly and logically greater than Elrond's one  :)

Navigation

[0] Themen-Index

[#] Nächste Seite

[*] Vorherige Sete