[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Lothlorien Suggestions

Galadriel

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CragLord:

--- Zitat von: Sir_Stig am 24. Nov 2015, 20:08 ---I didn't mean for her to level up exactly like Sauron, merely that it feels off to me to have her gaining levels by killing enemy units instead of acting to protect her people and realm (and not by just killing them...). I would like to see her made into a far, far less offensive unit, one that you just bring in to destroy buildings, not to kill hundreds of units. Maybe give her basically no base attack, instead let her have a magical shield that repels and knocks down enemy units. Give her a healing spell like the old samesingers, and have her level by granting her blessing and gifts on units, heroes and buildings. I realize she would be a force to reckon with on the battlefield if she chose to take up a sword and fight, but that doesn't fit her actions of mainly being a passive protector, her only real offensive action was to destroy Dol Guldur, and even then I don't think we should imagine that she was storming the stronghold like she does in the movies, barefoot and unarmed.
You might disagree and still want offensive Galadriel, but I just feel like it is contrary to how tolkien has written her, not as a great warrior, but as a great protector.

--- Ende Zitat ---
Well, I understand your point of view Sir Stig, but you must also be aware of current situation in Lorien concerning Galadriel's role and roles distribution in general.
First, I think you can't use her as weapon for killing hundreds of enemies (maybe if she accepts ring), and mainly she is used as building destroyer, which fits in her possibilities  from lore, I think this is used from info that she cleansed Dol Guldur almost by herself. Other memebers of White Concil were as mini support, and concerning that statement of barefoot and unarmed I can say you have probably right, but what kind of new skin you will suggest for her, to have armor? Armored Skin? I am not so found of it no matter how it looks, simply in my mind she is fairy capable of defending herself without that armor. She has great power in domen of defensive magic so I think in this way. Maybe I am wrong but it is my opinion) And if you want to use her in proper way, you simply won't use her in offensive way as first front of battle, she will always be at back, behind soldiers, doing her magic. So in my opinion she isn't offensive at all against units (I am refering about normal form in general).
I agree that she should be ruler and protector, but because of distribution of  roles in current situation I understand team decision to make her as she is in this situation, and I really don't have something great to complain about it.
She has all support abilities (almost except fear based one) in blessed and normal form, so I really don't see some big problem there with her offensive nature.
Her leveling system, no exp from killing enemies sounds reasonable, but I don't have problem with this also. After all no matter how fairy she looks, she is Ñoldor princess capable for doing scary things. :)
When I took everything into consideration, I think current implementation of Galadriel present nice balance between lore and game needs. And because of that I am not for any change. :)

Kind regards,
CragLord

Sir_Stig:
My main problem is that she levels by killing things, I just want a way for her to level without having to kill things. By the time you build her and get her to level 7 the game is basically over.

Walküre:

--- Zitat von: Sir_Stig am 24. Nov 2015, 20:08 ---I didn't mean for her to level up exactly like Sauron, merely that it feels off to me to have her gaining levels by killing enemy units instead of acting to protect her people and realm (and not by just killing them...). I would like to see her made into a far, far less offensive unit, one that you just bring in to destroy buildings, not to kill hundreds of units. Maybe give her basically no base attack, instead let her have a magical shield that repels and knocks down enemy units. Give her a healing spell like the old samesingers, and have her level by granting her blessing and gifts on units, heroes and buildings. I realize she would be a force to reckon with on the battlefield if she chose to take up a sword and fight, but that doesn't fit her actions of mainly being a passive protector, her only real offensive action was to destroy Dol Guldur, and even then I don't think we should imagine that she was storming the stronghold like she does in the movies, barefoot and unarmed.
You might disagree and still want offensive Galadriel, but I just feel like it is contrary to how tolkien has written her, not as a great warrior, but as a great protector.


--- Ende Zitat ---

The gameplay-related points I remarked in my previous comments exactly explain why it wouldn't be wise 'relegating' and binding Galadriel to a so strict supportive role, inevitably colliding with her status as the most powerful hero of the faction.
Her attack is meant to represent a widespread spell that obviously involves more than one unit; being it a very particular and unique type of attack among the other Elven Heroes, I really think that it's instead very suitable for her.

If you are a bit concerned about Galadriel picking open fights like a 'regular offensive' hero, then you should consider that this issue was solved in the Edain Mod 4.0, as in the 3.8.1 version she indeed seemed a bit out of place with her problematic role as a sort of tank (attacking directly) with mainly supportive abilities.

So, a less offensive role wouldn't have so much sense, as Galadriel already is a mainly supportive hero.
Some of your suggestions (like the magical shield) could bring things to the extreme side, like a very strict and imperative defensive role (that Galadriel doesn't need at all).

And, now, the cherry on top of the cake.
Those statements about Galadriel's role in the War of the Ring and her act towards Dol Guldur have really been a direct wound to me  [ugly]

Galadriel was anything but 'passive' during the War of the Ring.
In the books you will find many passages that clearly state that without her personal presence and powers Lothlórien would have ineluctably fallen either by the Enemy or the Time.
Tolkien specifically tells us that it was due to the power of Nenya (therefore Galadriel) that the three assaults against Lórien were repulsed, although the Galadhrim indeed fought bravely for their land.
You should always consider that the 'general mechanics' (War, defence, ruling, power) of enchanted kingdoms as Lothlórien are definitely different from the common (mainly human) kingdoms', since they greatly differ in Nature.

A similar thing can be applied also for her actions in Dol Guldur, not only significant for the War, but also symbolic as they resembled what Lúthien did in the First Age with another fortress of Sauron.
Galadriel should indeed be pictured walking barefoot and 'unarmed' while she storms that place with many possible varieties of destructive powers like shockwaves, dreadful weather-related phenomena, gates and walls crumbling at her presence or a mix of all these things, easily justified by what we know about this more-than-8000-year-old Noldorin Princess from Immortal Lands.

And, remember, Dol Guldur is an enchanted place, permeated by the dark power of Sauron.
Magic can most of the times be effectively countered only by Magic as well  8-)
This is a recurrent theme in the Tolkien's writings.

Saruman_the_wise:
Hello all I've always felt it strange that one of the greatest scouting abilities in game is taken away from Galadriel upon her rejecting the ring if anything it should improve the ability (which is not what i'm asking sort of) I know you want to keep it to no duo command sets which I find is much better as well but why not when she rejects the one ring galadriels fear ability "Gaze of Galadriel" and "Far sight or power of the seer" be combined and called "Gaze of the Elf Queen" or some thing there by improving the two abilities by making the fear stun cast-able across the entire map and retaining the very useful permanent far sight while giving it a little "kick" otherwise rejecting the ring especially early game is a double edged sword some thing which it should not be since that's the main idea about accepting the ring for all good heroes ( except Gandalf the white but he's a maiar so big difference)

The_Necromancer0:
I agree with this but i think that they should instead combine the effect so the player has either the choice to reveal a new location or scare enemy units in a already known location

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