New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills

[Aragorn II.]

CragLord why so aggresiv? You wanted to have comments from the german forum, and this is my opinion. We do not know that the Ered Mithrin and the IronHill fight together after the battle of Azanulbizar, but we do exactly know that the Dwarfs of the Ironhills and the people of Laketown fight together.

Maybe you should not defend your concept so angry and try to understand  the people which found that the Ironhills and Laketown fits well togehter.

[LordDainIronfoot]

CragLord why so aggresiv? You wanted to have comments from the german forum, and this is my opinion. We do not know that the Ered Mithrin and the IronHill fight together after the battle of Azanulbizar, but we do exactly know that the Dwarfs of the Ironhills and the people of Laketown fight together.

Maybe you should not defend your concept so angry and try to understand  the people which found that the Ironhills and Laketown fits well togehter.

One Battle in which they were FORCED to fight together doesn't make an alliance you see! You do know that the Dwarves of Iron Hilsl are Durins Folk and have come from Ered Mithrin right!?
And to Gnomi I am really dissapointed about your opinion on our ideas too se them jsut as adding more troops,it is nothing like that,just morediversity about the Dwarves race thats all! You always think we want things for no reason which is not like that!
And it seems you always tolerate and deffend the German Part more,nothing to say on the matter!
To me it is clear who is mroe objective ,to you all our ideas are waste of time and just unreasonable suggestions I see!
And please do not forget English is not our nattive language and we too have personal lifes and all,I am at work 12 hours a day and work at home too while prepare to study so you are not the only ones who spare time for the sake of this awesome Mod!I am sad tha you think this way but it says a lot to me!!

[Fredius]

Just a small thing from the me as team member:
If we need to read all english and all german parts of the forums (and all new moddb things) and answer everything we'ld have to spend least one hour per day just for reading.
Let's say we have every day about 1,5 hours for modding.
This would mean that we can only mod for about 30 minutes per day.
So we can't read everything. Especially not when we are doing other things, like goint outise, planning holidays and so on.

Additionally some german users have the same concern: They say that the team answers more questions for the english community and is also more active in the english areas.

So basically what I want to say:
You always just see what's bad for you. And the more active we're in the forums, the less time we have for modding.

You have a point there, but just look through all the threads in the English suggestion forums, and then look through the German ones. The amount of participation from the Team members in the English forums is far less than in the German forums. The German members can complain about the lack of attention, but looking at it from a neutral point one can see that the English forums get almost no attention at all.

Of course you don't have the time to read every suggestion or whatsoever, but wouldn't it hurt to sometimes respond to some suggestions posted in the English forums, mainly for big ideas like the Assembly Hall? This already can give the English members a better feeling that people actually take them serious. If no attention is given at all then you might as well remove the English suggestion threads.

Additionally your point is not a valid reason against this opinion.^^ For me the whole concept looks like: "Adding many more models, just to have more different troups ingame, just for the sake of more troups".(note: I don't mean the movie dwarves, I just mean more different designs) Some of them are from the movie, but still the point stands: I personally see no reason in gameplay. And I'm one of those guys who love a game more when there are less troups, but therefore every single trouple has a purpose and a reason to recruit. I know guys who like it more when there are more different units, even when have of them are just copies of other troups, but I prefer other things.

We don't want more troops, we just want to change the current ones that are litteraly copies of the troops from another faction. If I may exaggerate; it's basically saying that you are fine with giving Gondor troops from Morgul. And we don't demand to have those concepts implented into the next version of the mod, just do it when you feel like you want to; it's your mod after all.

We have many people who're still in school. Many of them can understand english, but discussing an entire topic is something completely different. You're always much more comfortable with your native tongue, as you have more possibilities to write something and you canw rite and read much faster. Additionally it's always more tiring to discuss in english than in german for us, especially when you're not used to communicate so much in english. It's easy to write 1-2 sentences, but writing a whole topic if you're not used to it isn't so easy.
Of course that counts for everyone, also many people from the english community, but I can fully understand when people want to discuss topic in their native tongue., when they have the opportunity for it.
Additionally noone forced anyone to discuss the same idea in both areas. Of course we are always happy and think that it's good when the two communities get closer to each other, but we can't and won't force the english community to speak english and we won't force the english community to speak german.

I happen to agree with you, translating one suggestion is already a pain in the ass , especially when both German and English are not my native languages. But still I do this because I have the feeling that the German and English forums are just too divided, I believe I already stated why I think so.

So:
Don't blame the team for answering some questions in the german forums, as we're doing the same here in the english parts. And also don't blame the german community for staying more in the german parts. If you'ld be in a forum with your native tongue for 2 or more years you also wouldn't just switch and do everything in english. And there are already some german users who are also discussing with you here in the english parts. Additionally people only write something to topics which they are interested in - and I have the feeling that the english concepts have a different style than the german ones. So it also can be that most german users just don't mind as much about the ideas which are discussed here, as they are more interested in other concepts. (and when you're not interested in a topic you're even less motivated to write in another tongue.^^)

We are actually very thankfull to you for participating in these discussions. Please know that we are not (all) English or American, just people from other countries who happen to speak English so we can communicate with each other. I also don't see much difference between the "English" concepts and the German ones, don't worry I also read some of them, what exactly is this difference in your opinion?

[Aragorn II.]

One Battle in which they were FORCED to fight together doesn't make an alliance you see! You do know that the Dwarves of Iron Hilsl are Durins Folk and have come from Ered Mithrin right!?

I do know that Durins Folk have lived in the Ered Mithrin But i didn´t know a Hero of the Ered Mithrin, which exist in the lore at the time in there the edain version of the Ironhills is mainly designed.

To me it is clear who is mroe objective ,to you all our ideas are waste of time and just unreasonable suggestions I see!

I don´t belive that Gnomi think that all your ideas are waste of time. Maybe he just doesn´t like the concept. I think it's nice that he tries to mediate between the two Forums and  suggestions in the German forum were also criticized.

[LordDainIronfoot]

I see no mediation at all it is alwasy the same,,we do not like that and German Forum is always right! So as much as I respect him an his Team,he is not objective at all!
We are not talking about the Hero Being Lore ,the hero is non canon the same as Drar and Murin,but the idea about Orocarni and Ered Mithrin is much more Lore friendly thatn Lake Town and the Hero is just to not have 2 ranged heroes in and to have different one that Bard!
But it seems to the Team having different Ourposts for each Dwarven Realm is no good and not needed and with that I have no choice but subdue,so I will stop the discussion about sicne it seems no facts can prove our point valid to you nor the team!
So have a great day from me!

[Fredius]

I don´t belive that Gnomi think that all your ideas are waste of time.

Actually that is just half of the truth. He just stated that the English concepts feel "different" to him than the German ones, perhaps that means that our suggestions are just weird proposals to him that shouldn't be taken seriously  . That's why I just asked him to elaborate that statement.

[CragLord]

Just a small thing from the me as team member:
If we need to read all english and all german parts of the forums (and all new moddb things) and answer everything we'ld have to spend least one hour per day just for reading.
Let's say we have every day about 1,5 hours for modding.
This would mean that we can only mod for about 30 minutes per day.
So we can't read everything. Especially not when we are doing other things, like goint outise, planning holidays and so on.

Additionally some german users have the same concern: They say that the team answers more questions for the english community and is also more active in the english areas.

So basically what I want to say:
You always just see what's bad for you. And the more active we're in the forums, the less time we have for modding.

This was mainly about Ea, thanks for reply.
That is all true and honest from you, but If I saw that Ea, instantly reply on german part about this matter, and he didn't post single reply in this topic from beginning, even famous "Sign", what should I/others think in general? Also this is one of the biggest threads on eng part.

Also of course I am aware about time distribution, I am just trying to be objective. I hope you undestand this in that way. About time in general, we all have our lives, and this forum is hoby matter, so if we spent a lot of time here and wrote walls of texts we have taken this matter seriously. In that term I really don't see why should free time of any member here be more precious in comparison.

You can say exactly the thing about yourself. You also have your standpoint, the same way others have theirs. Just because they don't like your standpoint doesn't mean that they are less objective than you're.

Man, I am not talking about what other or I like, point is Lake Town doesn't fit as Outpost for Iron Hills, that is objective lore matter! You will do what you want with your mod, we all know that. But it is annoying also when someone suggest something and then memeber of team says it is not lore wise. What should we think in that situation? Of course I am replying on similar situations not on stupid ideas...
And if you have read all of comments, they "pinned" to main battle in BOFA, simply they don't understand or don't know this wasn't intended from start. Dain wanted to fight/kill those poor Lake Town survivors! So please explain them meaning of word "objective".

For me the whole concept looks like: "Adding many more models, just to have more different troups ingame, just for the sake of more troups".(note: I don't mean the movie dwarves, I just mean more different designs) Some of them are from the movie, but still the point stands: I personally see no reason in gameplay. And I'm one of those guys who love a game more when there are less troups, but therefore every single trouple has a purpose and a reason to recruit. I know guys who like it more when there are more different units, even when have of them are just copies of other troups, but I prefer other things.

Lets be precise then.
Tell me honesty Gnomi what is point with all those Mordor units/models? How is possible if you have that kind of thinking that you let implementation of those "waste" armies of Morodor models?  Or maybe you see this still like problem in game?
Also, why you have integrated Dale for Erebor then? This is also new bonus units?
That is main problem here! You have implemented 2 correct Ouposts for 2 dwarven faction, and there wasn't place/good will/lack of references for third. I must tell you this, we are for some change! I am not talking here imperatively about integration of strictly assembly halls! Simply trying to defend my idea. We need something new for Iron Hills, that is main point here.

I personally don't like adding units "just for more different troups". I had no problems with the amount of troups in Bfme I where every faction had just one type of units for each role. For me the most important thing is the usability in the game and that there is a reason to buy this unit and not another unit.

This is as you said just model change... Also I could counter ague about current Esgorath models...

We have many people who're still in school. Many of them can understand english, but discussing an entire topic is something completely different. You're always much more comfortable with your native tongue, as you have more possibilities to write something and you canw rite and read much faster. Additionally it's always more tiring to discuss in english than in german for us, especially when you're not used to communicate so much in english. It's easy to write 1-2 sentences, but writing a whole topic if you're not used to it isn't so easy.
Of course that counts for everyone, also many people from the english community, but I can fully understand when people want to discuss topic in their native tongue., when they have the opportunity for it.
Additionally noone forced anyone to discuss the same idea in both areas. Of course we are always happy and think that it's good when the two communities get closer to each other, but we can't and won't force the english community to speak english and we won't force the english community to speak german.

Agree, I thought on memebers who can handle writing/reading. As I have said, I presume that "lot" of members understand and they are capable of communication. I mean, we don't expect all members to join discussion anyway.
Of course we are not forced to discuss in both areas, but mainly I could translate from german part and see many things which are not mentioned on eng part (Like was case with Murin raiders idea or other ideas from Vorschläge section). I hope you understand we in right way.

I can understand that other people prefer different things and therefore I wasn't writing something, because I currently have only less than one hour per day for modding and I don't want to spend 90% of it discussing things and afterwards having no time left to do anything productive for the mod.

I also don't have intention to waste you time dedicated for modding. I love this mod, other way, I won't do this! Only suggesting some ideas for improvements in my opinion ofc... This is serious waste of energy if you look from serious perspective, but I know that you know this fact.

Don't blame the team for answering some questions in the german forums, as we're doing the same here in the english parts. If you'ld be in a forum with your native tongue for 2 or more years you also wouldn't just switch and do everything in english. And there are already some german users who are also discussing with you here in the english parts. Additionally people only write something to topics which they are interested in - and I have the feeling that the english concepts have a different style than the german ones. So it also can be that most german users just don't mind as much about the ideas which are discussed here, as they are more interested in other concepts. (and when you're not interested in a topic you're even less motivated to write in another tongue.^^)

As I have said above, I will underline again.
We don't expect serous discussion about any of ideas with all team members, we are only expecting some short answers (You wrote nice long reply not first time I know that, and thank you, but situation on topic demanded that...) maybe, and that is matter of good will mainly.
In general I understand what you meant here, simple request is to give some indications in form of small answers for pointless topics in your (teams) opinion. In that way you spare our time and we spare more wasting of yours.

P.S. Just take a look at Aragorn's comments. I would dare to say some of them are provocative and sarcastic comments in general, also many similar comments in a row, this is something which makes discussion big and pointless at same time. When I said objective I meant objective. Next time please take that into consideration before you stand in "defence" of similar members!

Again, I have written here my honest thoughts,  I hope you will find them honest not only aggressive like mr Aragorn have said. Thank you for reply!

Regards

Edit: I started writing this comment immediately after you have posted yours, so I am sorry for other comments which I haven't take into consideration.

[Aragorn II.]

P.S. Just take a look at Aragorn's comments. I would dare to say some of them are provocative and sarcastic comments in general, also many similar comments in a row, this is something which makes discussion big and pointless at same time. When I said objective I meant objective. Next time please take that into consideration before you stand in "defence" of similar member

I don't wont to be provocative and sarcastic. I have just wrote my Opinion,  because some member of the english community want that a member from the german forum be a part of the discussion. And why are my posts less objective than yours? We have different opinions, this doesn't mean that one of them are more important than the other.

[Fredius]

I don't wont to be provocative and sarcastic.

And with all my respect the only connection between Iron Hilsl and Lake Town(which did't even had proper Army) is BoFA and thats all for the whole Third Age Period!?

No, but for the time, where the edain team had concepted the Ironhills

I find it better to have another Lore Hero than 2 identical Bards!?
So I am sorry to dissagree but I do not think Iron Hills has enough strong connections with Lake Town!

There is no Lore Hero for the Ered Mithrin in the time of the Hobbit
I think the connections between them are strong

But in this case, Lake Town don't have lore connections with Iron Hills. You have specified link from BOFA, I will tell you next, those dwarves wanted to crush people of Lake Town when they decide to stood between them and Erebor (from book). So it was natural they fought together against goblins and wargs when they wanted to kill them all. In other words, this isn't fact which could be used for integration of Lake Town as Outpost for Iron Hills. Also there is no lore reason for this.

Why is there no Lore reasons? They fight together in this battle.

What is more interesting 2 Different Kingdoms with 100% identical outposts and Units and Hero which do not have real connection or having a completely different units and hero with more lore connection?

Personally I think Laketown is more interesting. There is not an other fraction with more Lore connection, and which Hero do you mean?

Maybe you could use the units from Ered Mithrin in the travel stock (what is the name of the "Reiselager" in english?)

Aragorn, look at this post here. You actually laughed on every reply and I don't know about you, but to me that looks very sarcastic and provocative.

[Gandalf The Gray]

P.S. Just take a look at Aragorn's comments. I would dare to say some of them are provocative and sarcastic comments in general, also many similar comments in a row, this is something which makes discussion big and pointless at same time. When I said objective I meant objective. Next time please take that into consideration before you stand in "defence" of similar member

I don't wont to be provocative and sarcastic. I have just wrote my Opinion,  because some member of the english community want that a member from the german forum be a part of the discussion. And why are my posts less objective than yours? We have different opinions, this doesn't mean that one of them are more important than the other.

man with your logic then why put thorin son of dain should not be in the game because he was not in the battle of the five armies

[Gnomi]

As my answer got pretty long I will put everything in spoilers...^^

And to Gnomi I am really dissapointed about your opinion on our ideas too se them jsut as adding more troops,it is nothing like that,just morediversity about the Dwarves race thats all! You always think we want things for no reason which is not like that!

I never said that there is no reason. If you read my comment again you'll notice that I have written that I can understand your reasons, BUT I have just another focus as you on the game and some things don't matter for me, while they matter for you. (on the other hand some things that matter for me don't matter for you)
That's nothing special, just normal. I never said anywhere that you're doing something without a reason. But just because I can understand your reasons and agree that for people who focus on those things it would be a great addition to the game, it doesn't mean that I agree with them. As said: I have a different focus and the same counts for everyone. Everyone has different ideas and if 100 people could make edain, there would be 100 different edain versions. All would be good and every single version would have some great ideas and would be unique on its own way. Does this mean that I have to like them all? No, because I prefer a special type of games and just because others think that a game is good, I don't have to like it also.
Also in our team everyone has a different opinion on the game. And that's one of the points why I think edain became so popular:
Nearly everyone finds things in the mod he likes. Some find more, some less, but as edain includes the ideas of so many different people it helps all those people to like at least parts of it.

Do everyone likes everything?
No. And that's good, because then there is the possibility that someone with a different taste also has the possibility to like something.
The same counts for my last comment. As I've written as a personal opinion:
I don't care about many things, while they are important for other guys. I can understand and accept it. But therefore some other things are important for me. And if something includes parts of things which are important for me and for others, the chances are high that we don't want exactly the same. That doesn't mean that we can't have a normal discussion or at least try to understand that the other guy has a different opinion without being miffed.

And it seems you always tolerate and deffend the German Part more,nothing to say on the matter!

Perhaps it seems like that, but quite often I also dislike ideas from the german parts. Perhaps there are more ideas from there I like. But I won't just like an idea because I have to like the same amount of ideas from both parts in the forum, as this would be even less objective.
Additionally:
This is (again) my opinion when I write it. Mostly when it's an official statement or a team-opinion, I write "we" or something like "the team".

To me it is clear who is mroe objective ,to you all our ideas are waste of time and just unreasonable suggestions I see!

Cool down. I never said anything like that and I would never say it. For me it seems more as if you're being a bit miffed, because quite often I have a different opinion than you. I repeat myself: Just because I don't agree and think that my perspective is more important doesn't mean that I can't tolerate and accept your opinion. I would never write what you just alleged.

And please do not forget English is not our nattive language and we too have personal lifes and all,I am at work 12 hours a day and work at home too while prepare to study so you are not the only ones who spare time for the sake of this awesome Mod!I am sad tha you think this way but it says a lot to me!!

Have I ever written that I want you to stay here 24/7?
No.
The problem is that if some of our fans have to much to do and can't write something to every idea, then noone bats an eye. But if the team doesn't manage to write something to nearly every idea, then people get angrey. Get the difference? For you it's much simpler to participate on many discussions, as noone gets angry with you when you don't answer for a topic. Additionally we (as a team) don't want to participate in every discussion. We write something when there is an important fact (or at least it seems important for us, something like intern decisions, limits of the engine and so on), as we like the community to discuss things.
We've learned in the past that discussions quite often end as soon as a team member wrote something about it. As I've written a few days ago:
Even when we don't add the concrete concept of a fan in the game, we still get an idea what's wanted and then we can think about something that we as a team like and the fans like.
And what's the best way for us to get those information about our fans?
Those discussions. We read them and think about them. But comments from the team quite often leads to less discussions and less new ideas from the community, as many users just refer to our comments. (and those comments don't give us anything new, as we've written them ourselves )
Additionally:
You can always divide your time between forum and gaming as you want. But we can't do that as freely, as we get blamed when we don't answer in topics, but also get flamed when the next version takes too long. Therefore we always need to take a middle course and answer in as many topics as possible while still modding as fast as possible AND still continue to have fun with it (and from time to time perhaps even have time to play our own mod^^)

German Forum is always right!

Don't know where I wrote anything like that. As I've written above people always just see the bad things and not everything. This for example is not objective at all.
Why should I write:
'In the german forum there were 20 concepts today and I don't like a single one of them.'
Tell me: Why should I write it? But if we're discussing something and the same has already been discussed somewhere else, then I will tell you about it asap and as the german forum is MUCH older, many topics has already been discussed and we discussed them also in our intern forum. Therefore I can tell you the solutions of those discussions. (and sometimes, if you had the same discussion about 20 times you get bored of it and answer with a bit less text)

So finally:
Please read more carefully what I'm writing. Don't add new things I never wrote.

You have a point there, but just look through all the threads in the English suggestion forums, and then look through the German ones. The amount of participation from the Team members in the English forums is far less than in the German forums. The German members can complain about the lack of attention, but looking at it from a neutral point one can see that the English forums get almost no attention at all.

Just look at my comments. How often have I answered a german concept?
Most of my comments in the german part are either in areas which aren't edain suggestions, f.e. mapping support. I you combine my answers here and on moddb, then I'm doing at least 2-3 times as much work on the english parts than the german. Additionally most of our comments on the german parts are only comments with one line, something like "not possible".

Of course you don't have the time to read every suggestion or whatsoever, but wouldn't it hurt to sometimes respond to some suggestions posted in the English forums, mainly for big ideas like the Assembly Hall? This already can give the English members a better feeling that people actually take them serious. If no attention is given at all then you might as well remove the English suggestion threads.

I have written a bit about that in my answers to dainironfoot, especially at the end. As long as we don't say anything against it, we aren't completely against the idea as a team. Perhaps as individuals, but not as a team. As said: if you work in a team with 10 guys, there are at least 20 opinions about one topic.
As an example:
I never had problems with the bears, as I don't mind much about the graphics. So why should I write something about it?
But there are others in our team (like Ealendril) who love to make such details. If I would have written something like "I don't mind that, doesn't matter for me", everyone would be frustrated.
Therefore I don't write anything at all and voila: Ealendril implemented your suggestion and created completely new and fantastic looking bears.^^
When someone in our team likes an idea and also wants it in the game, then we will always discuss it in our intern forum. But if I don't mind about this topic, even when there are reasons... why should I write something? I know that there are reasons for it and against it. I don't mind, therefore I don't write as much. I personally think that it's better to fix some map-bugs than to write: "There are reasons against it and for it, but I don't really mind, as it wouldn't change anything for my gaming experience ingame."

I happen to agree with you, translating one suggestion is already a pain in the ass , especially when both German and English are not my native languages. But still I do this because I have the feeling that the German and English forums are just too divided, I believe I already stated why I think so.

I agree with you and think that it's great that you do it and it can only help everyone of us. If I would have more time I would help you with that, but currently I have so many commitments that I can't spend all my free time as freely as I'ld like to.^^

We are actually very thankfull to you for participating in these discussions. Please know that we are not (all) English or American, just people from other countries who happen to speak English so we can communicate with each other. I also don't see much difference between the "English" concepts and the German ones, don't worry I also read some of them, what exactly is this difference in your opinion?

I think there are a few differences:
1. I think that in the english community there are much more people who like the hobbit movies, while in the german community there are much more people who don't like the hobbit movies.
2.  In the german forum I have the feeling that it's more: "I want this to be integrated, so I think about a way to make it somehow special and important in the game, but spend less thinking about the design.", while in the english forum it's more "I want this to be integrated, so I think much about the concrete design and how everything looks like, but spend less thinking about the integration in the game and how it fits there."
I don't say that one approach is worse than the other, as both are really important for a game and both should be considered. But I always don't care about the concrete design as much as others do and I find the less graphical and more theoretical approach much more interesting. But again: That's my opinion and we have different members in our team and everyone has his own approach to the game/mod. None is better or worse than another. But not everyone is suited for every part.^^

One last thing from me: This (again) is something I can say only for myself and not for the team:
Answering all the different comments in the forum is the most difficult part. I think it has to be done, therefore I do it.
But that doesn't mean I enjoy it. I love to discuss about some topics, bu quite often it's just telling 5 guys per day that his problem could be solved by looking at the FAQ.
The problem with discussions is that they always cost a lot of time. In my last holidays I worked for about 8-10 hours per day (!) for edain. Mostly I was fixing bugs or reworking maps, but I also spent multiple hours answering questions, as 4.0 was rather new at that time. And yes, those 8-10 hours were no fun at all, but work. They were frustrating, monoton and just frustrating. Why did I do that? Because it had to be done.

All the time I spent at that time was missing afterwards, especially now, as I have to write my bachelor thesis in my holidays. After doing that I want to do something I like to relax. And the problem is that I can't relax in the forum.
I have to weigh every single word I write, because someone will always missunderstand it and will be offended. Everytime when I write something else then "wow great!" there will be someone who thinks that I don't like him, hate him, think he's an idiot, insulted him, wants to bash him or whatever. Even when I write something like: "I think there are some good parts in the idea, but not everything is great because xyz." some people will feel insulted. That's the burden of being in a team, especially when the team is becoming more and more famous and the community is getting bigger and bigger.
As a user you normally don't have so many problems, as other people don't weigh your words so much, but as a team member every single word is important. Therefore writing here is much more stressful for me than discussing things in other parts in the internet.
I'm just a very introverted person. I love to be alone, love to do my things and 'inform others about my opinion'. I'm happy when they agree and if they want we can discuss, but I do this more often in chats than the forum. (note: everyone can add me in skype, just don't expect me to always have time to chat when i'm online^^)
After the 2 months with 8-10 hours per day (7 days a week) I had problems with my health because of it. Therefore I spend less times than a few months ago in the forums and a bit more modding. The other members were more clever than me and new where their limits are without having to get health problems.
I like 99% of our fans and that's why I always want to answer, but I've accepted that I can't do it and it's better for me NOT to write and discuss so much in forums.
So please accept that I (and I think I can speak for the rest of the team also) just can't discuss about every single idea on moddb, english part of this forum, german part of this forum, intern forum, all the ideas we get via email, skype...
We just can't do that and still continue modding.^^

If someone wants to discuss anything further, please send me a PM and we can talk about it. All of this has nothing to do with this topic.

[Gimilzar]

(Blast it, Gnomi was faster )

I think this is getting out of hand and a moderator needs to be called in to take care.

Currently this so so much out of topic as you can possibly think of. It's no longer about the Concept whether or not an Assembly Hall should be introduced to Edain. It's more like a German Community vs English Community matchup. Even teammembers told you some of their concerns about this whole concept. In the overall in sounds nice on paper, but the problems start at the implementation.

Right now I'd suggest you'd calm down now, before things get spoken (written) you'll regret later. And please try to be less stubborness. We all know you guys have some kind of a "need-for-dwarf-attention". Currently there are more urgent things to discuss such as how to balance the game with an upcoming faction or specific spell reworks.

Honestly I see no point in this Idea of yours. A third subfaction for the Dwarves, completely different from the Dale/Laketown faction, would take too much time and effort for different modding projects. Just acknowledge someones opinion about certain topics and don't make a personal crusade out of it where you attack verbally that person who criticise your Idea. Just deal with it.

[Fredius]

Okay people I too agree about that we should end the discussion on this topic about the participation from the teammembers. If you really have something to say about this matter then please PM me and I'll try to summarize them all and send a PM to Gnomi, because I too have some little things I want to ask him myself. That will have to wait till tomorrow because its sleepy time now for me . Gnomi and the rest of the German community I want to thank you anyway for participating here, it means that the English forums have some meaning to after all.

So lets discuss this concept a bit further, closing it would be a waste imo.

[Linhir]

Guys, take a chill pill!

1. Aragorn II is just random troll, ignore him.

2. I personally don't agree about many things that Gnomi wrote, but I still respect him and have awareness that he's mod creator, not me. He may or he may not use mine or yours ideas, and we have to deal with it.

3. Yes, i think too that Dwarves of Iron Hills should get a new outopost.

4. If team members don't have many time to spend on mod, then they should focus on modding, not on forum. Good idea will be that few forum moderators will be choosed, which will read all suggestions and briefly pass them to the team. And then ET will choose if they want to take a closer look to ideas that sounds most interesting.

So Crag, Dain - chill.

Gnomi - Main reason that most of players chose Edain, is diversity from original. Diversity containing buildings, units, heroes, spells and many many more. So it's wouldn't be wise to limit them to only this ones who's most useful, as you like.
For example, before Edain I was playing "RJ" mod because it added new factions, heroes etc., and I only gave it up, because in my opinion, Edain have more potential in all this areas.

Aragorn II - Get back on german part. Leave now and never come back! 

[CragLord]

We all know you guys have some kind of a "need-for-dwarf-attention". Currently there are more urgent things to discuss such as how to balance the game with an upcoming faction or specific spell reworks.
Honestly I see no point in this Idea of yours. A third subfaction for the Dwarves, completely different from the Dale/Laketown faction, would take too much time and effort for different modding projects. Just acknowledge someones opinion about certain topics and don't make a personal crusade out of it where you attack verbally that person who criticise your Idea. Just deal with it.

Yes, we are obviously in that mood, is that bad?
I agree about fact there is more urgent things to do, also it is really funny fact that we lately almost always get that kind of answer, there is more important things to do...
Nobody here expect instant implementation of this idea or instant start of making any kind of new models. We are expecting just feedback in term of short answers, answers should be continue with this or not.
Any way, this discussion become futile in my opinion, so this is my last post on this matter probably...

Gnomi - Main reason that most of players chose Edain, is diversity from original. Diversity containing buildings, units, heroes, spells and many many more. So it's wouldn't be wise to limit them to only this ones who's most useful, as you like.
For example, before Edain I was playing "RJ" mod because it added new factions, heroes etc., and I only gave it up, because in my opinion, Edain have more potential in all this areas.

This is best comment on this topic, and it totally describes situation here.
Linhir, you should post this earlier and spare us of many comments.