[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] General Suggestions
Brief General Ideas
Julio229:
In my opinion, I don't like this change. Imladris' Stronghold reflects the fact that the Elves helped the remnants of Arnor to finish Angmar off, Glorfindel was a key part on defeating the Witch King, and both this outpost and the Earnur summon reflect the aid that Arnor got in their final days. Furthermore, the Dúnedain Rangers were never a lot, in the Arnor timeline they should be few as they only were part of the Cardolan barrowguards and the Aranarth rangers, I don't think an outpost for them in Arnor is fitting.
In Imladris, just making the already underpowered Glorfindel even harder to recruit would harm the faction, and I think the Dunedain outpost fits because, even if they are not a lot, Dunedain Rangers are on the side of Imladris, and Eriador as a whole. Imladris' external plots represent the different people of Eriador, the Hobbit Farm representing the Shire, the Lindon Watchtower (that fits both in Arnor and Imladris) represents Lindon (of course), and the Dúnedain Outpost reflects the fact that Imladris and them are allies, unlike in Arnor, where the Rangers are just a small part of the faction. The rangers have a bigger purpose in Imladris, both gameplay-wise and lore-wise, as the protectors of Eriador and the way for Imladris to produce cheaper units.
So, in my opinion, this change would harm both factions, losing Glorfindel and his Riders in Arnor, which are useful in gameplay and fitting in lore, and making Glorfindel be worse in Imladris by making him only recruitable in an Outpost. Also, I think the way it is right now includes more elements from the lore, with Glorfindel helping the Men of the North and the Dúnedain being allies with Imladris, but not just a part of their army (which I believe the settlement would make them feel like, like the Ithilien Rangers.)
EDIT: What I think could be made to give Arnor some more variety is making their Rangers able to change weapons between sword and bow, if they receive Aranarth's upgrade. That way they'd get other elite unit without changing a lot.
DrHouse93:
I've explained bad the advantages the Dunedain Outpost gives to Imladris, my mistake. I'll analyze them more specifically, then:
1. Different types of units (but of course, that can be achieved also in a settlement building)
2. The Storage Tent gives +540 command points
3. The Medic Tent heals your allies and grants leadership
4. The Watchtower grants good defenses (you have at least 8 Dunedain firing arrows and 4 patroling the outpost)
5. And also the Troops Tent allows the recruitment of the Dunedain, Halbarad and a Siege Machine
(These are the military boost I was talking about^^)
Furthermore, each expansion grants you +10 resources regularly. This means that Imladris can have access (in a reasonable short amount of time) a powerful option, and cheaper than the regular outpost, for its expansion plot, which simultaneously grants to the faction troops, leadership, healing, command points, defenses, siege engines and resources (while on a regular outpost you would need 5 different buildings to have them all, and I think the Imladris Fortress or a Dunedain Camp wouldn't represent at its best the huge usefulness of the Dunedain Outpost nor its deep connection with the Noldors)^^
--- Zitat von: Julio229 am 28. Sep 2016, 22:50 ---In Imladris, just making the already underpowered Glorfindel even harder to recruit would harm the faction, and I think the Dunedain outpost fits because, even if they are not a lot, Dunedain Rangers are on the side of Imladris, and Eriador as a whole. Imladris' external plots represent the different people of Eriador, the Hobbit Farm representing the Shire, the Lindon Watchtower (that fits both in Arnor and Imladris) represents Lindon (of course), and the Dúnedain Outpost reflects the fact that Imladris and them are allies, unlike in Arnor, where the Rangers are just a small part of the faction. The rangers have a bigger purpose in Imladris, both gameplay-wise and lore-wise, as the protectors of Eriador and the way for Imladris to produce cheaper units.
So, in my opinion, this change would harm both factions, losing Glorfindel and his Riders in Arnor, which are useful in gameplay and fitting in lore, and making Glorfindel be worse in Imladris by making him only recruitable in an Outpost. Also, I think the way it is right now includes more elements from the lore, with Glorfindel helping the Men of the North and the Dúnedain being allies with Imladris, but not just a part of their army (which I believe the settlement would make them feel like, like the Ithilien Rangers.)
EDIT: What I think could be made to give Arnor some more variety is making their Rangers able to change weapons between sword and bow, if they receive Aranarth's upgrade. That way they'd get other elite unit without changing a lot.
--- Ende Zitat ---
I agree with this^^
Walküre:
--- Zitat von: dgsgomes am 28. Sep 2016, 16:45 ---Finally, just a small observation: Imladris will have 3 heroes that are build out of the fortress: Cirdan, Halbarad and, now, Glorfindel. This makes a lot of sense to me, as the ET wanted Imladris' strenght to be resided on it's heroes as well, and it will become even harder to have all/most of the heroes in the matches.
--- Ende Zitat ---
The fact that heroes are the focus of the faction's strength doesn't automatically infer the conclusion you came up with. There is a strong argument against that: both Círdan and Halbarad belong to other subfactions different from the main core of the faction, while Glorfindel resides exactly in Rivendell as the champion and one of the guardians of that sacred valley (I personally see him as one of the 'military chiefs', in charge of patrolling and reconnaissance). Why should he be placed outside the main fortress in the first place? It would just be like having Celeborn or Gandalf available not in the main stronghold but in secondary outposts.
--- Zitat von: Julio229 am 28. Sep 2016, 22:50 ---In my opinion, I don't like this change. Imladris' Stronghold reflects the fact that the Elves helped the remnants of Arnor to finish Angmar off, Glorfindel was a key part on defeating the Witch King, and both this outpost and the Earnur summon reflect the aid that Arnor got in their final days.
In Imladris, just making the already underpowered Glorfindel even harder to recruit would harm the faction, and I think the Dunedain outpost fits because, even if they are not a lot, Dunedain Rangers are on the side of Imladris, and Eriador as a whole. Imladris' external plots represent the different people of Eriador, the Hobbit Farm representing the Shire, the Lindon Watchtower (that fits both in Arnor and Imladris) represents Lindon (of course), and the Dúnedain Outpost reflects the fact that Imladris and them are allies, unlike in Arnor, where the Rangers are just a small part of the faction. The rangers have a bigger purpose in Imladris, both gameplay-wise and lore-wise, as the protectors of Eriador and the way for Imladris to produce cheaper units.
--- Ende Zitat ---
I completely agree with Julio. These are the fundamental motives underlying the current mechanics. Rivendell's stronghold in Arnor symbolises the canonical alliance between the Eldar and the descendants of the Númenóreans, following the footsteps of the ancient friendship between the Edain and the Elves of Beleriand, and obviously reminding also of the pivotal deeds of the Last Alliance in the Second Age. This is a too iconic of a connection to be done without in favour of focusing further on the Dúnedain (in an already Dúnedain-dominated faction).
As for Imladris, the settlements and the outpost do represent the multicoloured variety of the inhabitants of Eriador and their common struggle in containing the Evil from those lands, alongside showing in a very subtle way that Imladris doesn't seek to expand itself beyond its sacred borders (in line with its blessed characterisation as a secluded sanctuary that mirrors the splendour of the West in the mortal Middle-earth). I thus still don't understand the need of replacing the current unique subfaction with the former fortress of Imladris from BFME2, when the heart of all is already Imladris itself and you may already dispose of an Elven outpost. I'm not saying that your reasoning concerning balance doesn't have a logic, dgsgomes, but those aspects should be generally justified by conceptual arguments in the first place, and I think your proposal exactly lacks consistency in regards of the points related to differentiation and uniqueness I addressed above.
Slawek56703:
Hey Edain Team is there a way to give Siege units some guard around them that will protect them from enemies some melee guys around like 4 or 5 guys and maybe some archers in the back ?
In outpost :Imlaris Stronghold good but Glrofindel and his Raiders are already in Imladris so
change would be welcome .
I think we should look more into Epilouge we had there we had Noldor Warriors Imladris in Edain mod had Veterans of last Alliance they should be move to Imladris Stronghold without hero . Imladris Stronghold would cost 1000 becouse there is smaller wariety of units (only one unit).
Ealendril der Dunkle:
--- Zitat ---Hey Edain Team is there a way to give Siege units some guard around them that will protect them from enemies some melee guys around like 4 or 5 guys and maybe some archers in the back ?
--- Ende Zitat ---
No, sadly that's not possible.
--- Zitat ---In outpost :Imlaris Stronghold good but Glrofindel and his Raiders are already in Imladris so
change would be welcome .
I think we should look more into Epilouge we had there we had Noldor Warriors Imladris in Edain mod had Veterans of last Alliance they should be move to Imladris Stronghold without hero . Imladris Stronghold would cost 1000 becouse there is smaller wariety of units (only one unit).
--- Ende Zitat ---
I don't agree with that. Arnor is a map feature of Gondor, so it has to own the same playstyle with the same unit constellation. Gondor has the Dol Amroth Stronghold on the outpost with Imrahil (mount hero) and his riders. Arnor has as equivalent an Imladris Stringhold with Glorfindel (mount hero) and his Windriders.
I don't think we will change that.
Aranarth is the one who founded the "Dunedain" after the fall of his fathers kingdom. Our Arnor is set on the timeline shortly before the fall of Arnor, so it wouldn't make sense to give the Dunedain a more important role.
Of course, we have given Aranarth the possibility to follow the path of the Dunedain - but this is only a small feature to make this hero more interesting and unique.^^
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