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Autor Thema: Brief Mordor Suggestions  (Gelesen 87693 mal)

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #150 am: 19. Sep 2017, 00:06 »
Yeah, right. But I still prefer more unit centered image not battle centered.

Me too. The Necromancer will thus rest as an exceptional case in the game.

kmogon

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #151 am: 12. Okt 2017, 13:06 »
I would like to raise the issue of Annatar - the lord of gifts.
His graphic concept in Edain was never too convincing for me, in other words it does not look like someone I could trust XD. In the games Shadow of .... , he is presented very well (the only thing that came out) - he looks like friendly elf which is hiding sth, not a strange ghost person. So my question is:  is it possible to replace the current look of the Annatar to the one appearing in the Shadow of Mordor ?

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #152 am: 12. Okt 2017, 14:43 »
I would like to raise the issue of Annatar - the lord of gifts.
His graphic concept in Edain was never too convincing for me, in other words it does not look like someone I could trust XD.

He's in fact someone one should NOT definitely trust :D

In my opinion, his overall concept is probably one of the most loyal to the lore and most appealing too, in terms of graphics (and this is the theme we're discussing now). We have very scarce material at hand that comes from the cinematographic adaptation; nearly nothing at all, I daresay, in that the only appearance of him from the films is provided by a sequence that was later jettisoned completely. Nevertheless, I believe we should be content with what we are offered by the LOTR trilogy, instead of looking for other alternatives. Currently, the Lord of Gifts does give the sense of an apparently noble figure of light, generous and willing to help cure the world; on the contrary, his spike-shaped armour suggests that he's not what he proclaims to be. Ambiguity and opposing elements which mingle with each other. That's a very on-point characterisation, reflected by the model.

kmogon

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #153 am: 12. Okt 2017, 16:06 »
I'm glad that you Wülkirie shared your opinion about state of annatar's demanour.

"Currently, the Lord of Gifts does give the sense of an apparently noble figure of light, generous and willing to help cure the world; on the contrary, his spike-shaped armour suggests that he's not what he proclaims to be."

I cannot agree with this "simbolic" look. I meam that showing sb's intents by his apperance isn't good way. Especially when Annatar called himself envoy of Valars and Celebrimbor belived him so he had to look like one of them. We can see good example in other implementation of maiar's help - Saruman. He came to middleerth as a wise and experienced man. Even after his fall to Sauron power, he still looks like "master craftsmen" and he could fool even other istari.I know that there are plenty of symbols in whole Tolkien's work but I wouldn't implemet it in that way.

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #154 am: 13. Okt 2017, 01:18 »
I instead say that it is exactly this symbolic guise that suits the character well. The best implementation. Symbols have a fundamental role in the lore of Arda and in the entirety of Tolkien's writings. It is symbols which speak and tell more than meets the eyes. I could name countless examples: Morgoth and his scars that nothing could cure, Sauron's corrupted fashion after the fall of Númenor, Saruman's multicoloured robes or the weary gaze of Círdan (profound as naught else and indicative of his millenary age). You may see how the physical shape is much revealing, most of the times.

Now, the current model of the Lord of the Gifts does embody an angelic creature, enlightened and emanating radiance. I get what you mean. This is enough, though. There wouldn't be much point in having a totally blessed form of the hero wander around among the ranks of the most evil of the factions: Mordor. The concept on which the model was fashioned shows already what must be shown. The player should see that such bright figure is characterised also by ambiguous sides that hide his true intentions. Sauron's abilities betray also the real schemes he's up to. In simple words, we need know that we're in front of a malicious presence, despite its fair appearance. The concept of LOTR I find just and sound for the purpose. One could say that it's even a kind of miracle that we have a concept in the first place, although the content didn't pass PJ's test.

Also, don't forget that not all Elves were deceived by Sauron. The wisest managed to turn his sham offer down. Namely, Gil-galad, Galadriel and Círdan. If I recall correctly, it is written in the Silmarillion that Sauron had a somewhat cunning and overall suspicious aura around him; detail that those mighty Elves had not missed. Celebrimbor was fascinated more by Sauron's wide-ranging knowledge of the secrets of metallurgy, rather than his fair shape. It's true that turning into a noble figure helped the Dark Lord's plan, yet that was not the sole element of the equation.

The_Necromancer0

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #155 am: 19. Okt 2017, 12:48 »
I've had a good look at Morgul Shadows and I'm still confused, so basically the description states:
"The life of Morgul Shadow is bound to the will of the Ringwraiths \n Any life the Morgul Shadow loses, will be transfered to nearby Nazgûl \n \n passive ability"

If that's the case I would suggest that the system be switched around, both from a lore-wise perspective it's more likely that the Nazgul feed on lesser wraith to heal themselves and from a gameplay perspective everybody would prioritize a expensive hero over free units.
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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #156 am: 19. Okt 2017, 13:24 »
Isn't that exactly what the description states? Nazgul get healed when Morgul Shadows are taking damage? Or am I missing something here?^^

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #157 am: 19. Okt 2017, 14:59 »
After rereading your post 50 times I finally get it. Once you understand the effect then description makes sense but until you explained the effect I was confused. The descriptions should be something more like:

"The life of Morgul Shadow is bound to the will of the Ringwraiths \n Any damage dealt to morgul shadows will heal nearby Nazguls \n \n passive ability"

Or something similar.
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dkbluewizard

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #158 am: 20. Okt 2017, 07:18 »
I'm glad that you Wülkirie shared your opinion about state of annatar's demanour.

"Currently, the Lord of Gifts does give the sense of an apparently noble figure of light, generous and willing to help cure the world; on the contrary, his spike-shaped armour suggests that he's not what he proclaims to be."

I cannot agree with this "simbolic" look. I meam that showing sb's intents by his apperance isn't good way. Especially when Annatar called himself envoy of Valars and Celebrimbor belived him so he had to look like one of them. We can see good example in other implementation of maiar's help - Saruman. He came to middleerth as a wise and experienced man. Even after his fall to Sauron power, he still looks like "master craftsmen" and he could fool even other istari.I know that there are plenty of symbols in whole Tolkien's work but I wouldn't implemet it in that way.


Everyone remember this, Sauron lost his ability in the Second Age to take a "Fair Form" he can still do this through illusion--which is what the Edain Team shows by him having red eyes and dressed in black as Gorthaur,  a giant ugly werewolf, a swarm of bats (not like the book where he was really big)--the only thing missing is his Snake Form. Would really love to see that form implemented.
Outside of Lord of the Rings, I am pretty sure Vengeance of Valdorian & Leoj's Wrath are the best novels I have read.

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #159 am: 21. Okt 2017, 02:21 »
Although the His Deadliest Servants spell portrays Nazgûl in a new fashion, armoured and not cloaked, I thought that this icon could be used for the central spell of Mordor; namely, the spell I mentioned at the beginning of the comment.

The image shows the first time when we're introduced to the wraiths in the trilogy and the scene itself is quite evocative. The Nine are sent to hunt down the One Ring and so they obey the most imperative of their master's biddings. They're truly Sauron's deadliest servants and most loyal slaves, if we may dare speak about loyalty for anything concerning the Dark Lord. The current picture would be still retained in the game, by each of the wraiths that must purchase his individual upgrade. It is just to refurbish the icon of the central spell a little bit, being that an iconic moment in the film. What do you think about it?


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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #160 am: 21. Okt 2017, 03:45 »
Given that the spell is about the Nazgul's unveiling, I think that the current icon with the armored Nazgul works well enough.

Then again, given that this is the first time we see them in the film (not counting the opening narration, which doesn't really count) the image you propose is also fitting.



Tangentially related: could the purchasing of this spell (or alternatively, having all Nine on the field) trigger the musical cue 'Revelation of the Ringwraiths'?

dkbluewizard

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #161 am: 21. Okt 2017, 18:14 »
Although the His Deadliest Servants spell portrays Nazgûl in a new fashion, armoured and not cloaked, I thought that this icon could be used for the central spell of Mordor; namely, the spell I mentioned at the beginning of the comment.

The image shows the first time when we're introduced to the wraiths in the trilogy and the scene itself is quite evocative. The Nine are sent to hunt down the One Ring and so they obey the most imperative of their master's biddings. They're truly Sauron's deadliest servants and most loyal slaves, if we may dare speak about loyalty for anything concerning the Dark Lord. The current picture would be still retained in the game, by each of the wraiths that must purchase his individual upgrade. It is just to refurbish the icon of the central spell a little bit, being that an iconic moment in the film. What do you think about it?



Meh, Tomatoe Toematoe
Outside of Lord of the Rings, I am pretty sure Vengeance of Valdorian & Leoj's Wrath are the best novels I have read.

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #162 am: 22. Okt 2017, 01:06 »
Then again, given that this is the first time we see them in the film (not counting the opening narration, which doesn't really count) the image you propose is also fitting.

That's the prime reason of my suggestion. Being the central spell of the faction might suggest that a proper picture should be the final rendition. The linkage provided by the cinematographic motive would reinforce the visual potential of the icon. The current image won't be completely erased and will still stay in each hero's power set.

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #163 am: 13. Nov 2017, 00:11 »
My suggestions :
1, mordor need warg riders , because they have ( like in the movie )
2, Need a wall around mordor's castle like angmar (at start of the game avaible choose whitch type (like the dwarfs ) :)
3,some new orc captains in the heroes who's  there  ( minas thirith's siege  )
4, mordors avarage orck need to be replace with morgul or gorgoroth or dol goldur  or cirit  ungol orck ( it an update in the citadel the update's ty decide whitch type of units will be avaible like dwarfs ) 
5,mordor's archers like morgul or dol  gordul  need to be bigger range
6, in  the outposts menu ( strongholds need to be  replaced  some type of strong economic bulding like isengard ( some type of  big mine or mine network ) and another bulding where mordor can train easterling and etc )  ( raise the price of orcs )

in mordor was much larger mines than in isengard and much more resources and more potential to create some new dewasteting weapon or bigger economic bulding or weapon than isengard , because mordor armor much more orcs than isengard , mordo has almost unlimited resources , I read this in posts about Isengard vs Mordor !

I really like this mode , so I hope it could be better than ever !
I'm waiting 4.5  [uglybunti]

For this time that's all !
I hope we can talk soon,
« Letzte Änderung: 13. Nov 2017, 19:36 von solteszbenjamin@gmail.com »

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Re: Brief Mordor Suggestions
« Antwort #164 am: 13. Nov 2017, 01:15 »
All those varieties of Orcs just need their proper barracks. It's the only way to ensure a decent degree of differentiation in the game, alongside sticking to the canons, because it's clearly shown how the power of Sauron's realm was not confined only in the sole Mordor. Thus, having all sorts of troops available in the common barracks could really turn out to be a potential conceptual loss for the faction. An eventuality we should avoid.

As for walls, the customary logic reads that evil factions do not have the need of such a defence, for their features are supposed to be mainly aggressive and the Evil itself, lore-wise, did wage war to the whole world with a long-planned sudden strike (it was therefore the Good that had to defend itself and adopt defensive strategies, and not the opposite). In the main, that's the core logic. Angmar is an exception in itself and the very Mordor embodies perfectly the idea of an evil faction which may afford the luxury to renounce building walls.