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Autor Thema: New Angmar Ringhero  (Gelesen 22462 mal)

DrHouse93

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #15 am: 11. Jul 2016, 03:26 »
Sauron won't become the Ring Hero of Angmar, because he is already the Ring Hero of Mordor.

I agree with this, if we're looking for uniqueness (which is one of the points which makes Edain awesome). But I think that the main feature which should be the prominent one should be the lore. The lore should be more important than uniqueness to me, and I think this is also the reason why you chose to not make Elrond use the Ring (developing an unique-system, of course, but before than anything keeping in mind the lore) and you chose to not give Azog his name, but only his title :)

True, Sauron is already the Ringhero of Mordor, but not giving him the Ring with Angmar in favor of the Witch-king would certainly be unique, but from the point of view of the lore, it would be completely nosense, imo (as it would be having Mornamarth as the only Ringhero of Angmar)

Furthermore, I'd like to point out that more than once, to not contradict lore, you chose to adopt some compromises (like what you did for the Misty Mountains heroes) or even ignore uniqueness (Rohan and Gondor have the same weather spell - and before Elbereth Gilthoniel was developed, Lorien had it, too - Also, Lorien and Gondor both have the Eagles Summon) :)

FG15

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #16 am: 11. Jul 2016, 09:22 »
Sauron won't become the Ring Hero of Angmar, because he is already the Ring Hero of Mordor.
I agree with this, if we're looking for uniqueness (which is one of the points which makes Edain awesome). But I think that the main feature which should be the prominent one should be the lore. The lore should be more important than uniqueness to me, and I think this is also the reason why you chose to not make Elrond use the Ring.
Elrond's Ring system is different from all existing Ring systems, which a simple Sauron system wouldn't be.
Moreover, if one wanted to make the Ring system completly lore arrcurate, than Sauron wouldn't be just the Ring Hero of Mordor (and Angmar), but also a possible Ring Hero of Isengard (he even send a Nazgul to get the Ring, when the Hobbits were captured), of the Misty Mountains (they would either bring him the ring directly or be influenced enough by the ring), and even the Dwarves (Dain had the theoretical option to give the Ring to Sauron).
On the good side, Gandalf would have done nothing but giving the Ring to a Hobbit, when Theoden was healed Aragorn or Gandalf were near and would have given it to a Hobbit, Galadriel didn't take the ring herself, but given it to a Hobbit, and with Erebor Bilbo would be the Ring Hero.

The player would have Sauron with the evil factions and a Hobbit, who can become invisible with the good factions. Wouldn't that be lore wise and great?


The ring system is a "What if ..." scenario. And in the case of the Witchking it's the question, what if the Witchking of Angmar had gotten the ring, but Sauron would still be too weak to come and take it himself. So, someone needs to bring him the Ring and the Witchking wouldn't have trusted any of his servants enough to do that instead of him. But because the forces of the Witchking are under attack he can't leave imediantly and has to keep it for some time.

That's as lore wise as most other ring systems. Furhtermore, the Witchking has one of the coolest and most unique Ring systems at the moment.

Ealendril der Dunkle

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #17 am: 11. Jul 2016, 12:18 »
Dont forget that the Witch King is the central person of the faction and the whole basic concept refers to his power acquisition. It would be mechanically poor when the core figure of the faction is replaced at once by another hero, and thereby becomes unimportant. These are conceptual and game mechanical elements that must be adhered to. Therefore there will be no Sauron in Angmar.

Elite KryPtik

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #18 am: 11. Jul 2016, 14:07 »
Fair enough, but I still think that giving the player some choices about their Ring Hero would be great, letting them give it to Mornamarth or Durmarth as an alternative in a what if scenario of if they got it before the Witch King and overthrew him. Diversity is one of the big selling points of Angmar, so having a diverse range of Ring Heroes would fit nicely I think.
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Secret Keeper

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #19 am: 11. Jul 2016, 14:22 »
I agree with Elite. Sauron is unnecessary in Angmar. Forget about him, but Mornamarth scenario would by very insteresting.

makis89

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #20 am: 16. Jul 2016, 13:29 »
I also agree that Mornamarth would be an intresting option to give him the one Ring..don't forget that he desires power more than discipline (  Witch-king) so to take secretly the ring it is a very possible scenario
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d0m0a

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #21 am: 17. Jul 2016, 13:05 »
Well, I can suggest something for the Witch King.

If he gets the Ring, why not turn him into something as the Thrall Masters? Come on, be the unit that control more units, but instead of be only basic units, why he don't call the other 8 Nazgul for protect him?

The Witch King has the Ring after all, and must be protected for avoid be lost again, so why not the 8 Nazgul joins him in a group for fight fo him? Clearly, the Witch King will be in charge, but the others will at least fight with him and ride with him if he mounts his horse. And, if he dies, so goodbye ring and goodbye Nazgul until he recovers the ring again.

lordoflinks

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #22 am: 24. Jul 2016, 07:59 »
Well, I can suggest something for the Witch King.

If he gets the Ring, why not turn him into something as the Thrall Masters? Come on, be the unit that control more units, but instead of be only basic units, why he don't call the other 8 Nazgul for protect him?

The Witch King has the Ring after all, and must be protected for avoid be lost again, so why not the 8 Nazgul joins him in a group for fight fo him? Clearly, the Witch King will be in charge, but the others will at least fight with him and ride with him if he mounts his horse. And, if he dies, so goodbye ring and goodbye Nazgul until he recovers the ring again.
This idea is actually really cool. From a lorewise perspective the Nazgul main purpose are to find and guard the ring so the WK picks up the ring and Sauron allows him to use it to end whatever battle he is fighting in, and so the Nazgul protect him.
On a side note now the Dwarf Ring Heroes gain both buffs and abilities from the Ring, the WK is even more underwhelming. :(
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Odysseus

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #23 am: 24. Jul 2016, 19:38 »
Oh wow, actually, that is a very cool concept. The other Nazgûl come to his aid when picks up the ring. Like an evil counter part to the Fellowship of the Ring.
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Darkayah

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #24 am: 24. Jul 2016, 19:51 »
No... I think ' the Companions ' should remain something special , and should not doubling.
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Odysseus

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #25 am: 24. Jul 2016, 20:06 »
Opinions, they differ mate ;).
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kmogon

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #26 am: 25. Jul 2016, 12:31 »
What about that concept of Mornamarth being a ring hero :
One reason that men of Car Dum join to the Witch King was to return old days when Arnor was rich kingdom and controled north of eriador . So in that case Mornamath would take a ring to restore Arnor - he would nominate himself as the high king of Arnor - he would rule hard hand and probably continue his boss's plan . Aditionally he would enslave hilmen and orcs to fight for his side  . Of course Witch King would try to take ring for his master but dunedains was the main force in his army. Other not as loialty heroes would probably stand for the strongest . To sum up the first nazgul would be surrounded by enemies ( Mornamath , Arnor , Imladris ) and has to escape until the ring corrupt new owner . With him all magic would also go away from angmar like wraths , werewolfs , mages and probably wolves too. New king would star spread his kingdom , probably some of fallen dunedains see in him hope and join. That mean dunedain units would be cheaper also There would be  place for new units ( which, I know, is hard to do, but maybe horsemen on werewolfs place  ) . Hillmen and orcs would be free ( the praise of ygrał master would stay ) - they wouldn't be partners - but slaves so they have to give all what they have ( that means tribute carts would come more often ) and their villages would be protected by men of car dum to better keeping control over them . Imstead of barrow wights on a settlement would be guard tower to better keep borders of new kingdom . There is questionable which heroes would stay with new ruler - krash of course would disappear with other wrights , some of them can be promoted ( like helegwen or zaphragor ) to recompesate disapearring others . On the end if king Mornamath would die Witch King would return with his anger - Monamath would be allow to return on barrow field .

Additionaly I hear some voices to include main enemy from battle in the north in angmar fraction - if Mornamath has his quotes why this guy wouldn't be his ring hero skin.



I mean : ygrał = thrall and Mornamath wouldn't be allow to return after die . Sorry for mistakes but it was too long text :-)
« Letzte Änderung: 25. Jul 2016, 20:25 von Ealendril »

Garlodur

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #27 am: 29. Jul 2016, 12:13 »
I do think there are some interesting aspects to the Witch-King summoning other Nazguls to his side. Mostly from the point of the Witch-King who needs to be defended as long as the Ring is not with his master.

In-game I would say that the Witch-King is turned into a hero battalion with 3-5 other Nazguls. Having all of them together sounds a bit too much in a faction that is not directly controlled by Sauron. We can imagine that Sauron still needs some Nazguls in particular places to do his evil work. This hero battalion would increase the Witch-King's role as a mass-slayer combined with an everlasting winter. If this hero battalion similar to the Fellowship doesn't work technically, it could also be the Mordor Nazgul heroic battalion summoned by his side or bought at the citadel.

Alternatively, the Witch-King is protected by his most loyal servants, i.e. the Fallen Dúnedain of Carn Dum. These are represented by the Black Guard, both on foot and mounted. These heroic battalions get a new ability that is unlocked when the Witch-King claims the Ring (I hope this is mechanically possible). As of now they have three abilities that I do not know the details of, but the first time I saw them I felt they were not very innovative compared to Castellans or Morgul Knights and all in the same line. This new ability could be a passive or active ability that increases defensive values of these units near the Witch-King or all heroes.

I hope this addition creates some more debate surrounding the Witch-King's Ring function.

Canis carcharothias

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #28 am: 29. Jul 2016, 12:46 »
The nazgul idea is not bad at all. Makes some sense and a good antagonism to the company of the ring. To make them a little different from Mordor's nazguls, they could be wearing the Hobbit films armor and wielding the film weapons (but not like ghosts). I don't like them, but I know that lots of players crave for that, and we have the witch king in shining armor, so it could work well aesthetically and give some opportunities for them to have some distinct abilities.

Just my two cents.
« Letzte Änderung: 29. Jul 2016, 13:18 von Canis carcharothias »

Secret Keeper

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Re: New Angmar Ringhero
« Antwort #29 am: 29. Jul 2016, 16:14 »
How about that: after WK picks the ring, 8 remaining nazguls appear and form a circle around him. WK would not directly fight, until you kill atleast 1 nazgul ( so you can get closer to him). He, as a WITCH king and holder of the ring, would cast a powerfull spells as his "attack". If you get close to him, he would draw his famous mace( similar to denethor new system in 4.4). Nazguls would fight directly and he would fight indirectly, through spells.