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Autor Thema: Edain 4.5 Demo  (Gelesen 2832 mal)

ElessarTelcontar

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Edain 4.5 Demo
« am: 25. Jun 2019, 17:42 »
Hello everyone,

I have an idea, as we have waited 4.5 for so long may be devs can release a demo of 4.5 which includes core updates, so we can test the game and can give feedback. Also we will be able to know what to expect from the 4.5 (I mean game play).

Have a nice summer.
« Letzte Änderung: 1. Jul 2019, 00:32 von ElessarTelcontar »
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

Gnomi

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #1 am: 25. Jun 2019, 18:07 »
Making a demo at the current state would take longer than just finishing 4.5.
Also what do you want in a demo? A demo is a version where some features are enabled and some are disabled, so you won't really see what you can expect from 4.5.^^

ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #2 am: 27. Jun 2019, 16:40 »
Hey Gnomi,

Demo is demonstration. :o You dont't have to disable some features to make a demonstration. You can relaese a demo which includes faction updates like spellbooks etc., new weapons, changes in siege mechanics and changes you already made. It would not be that hard and take so much time to release something like that as I am guessing you are already testing what you have done.  ;) And we can taste and weigh the new gameplay. We can start a poll to see if I am the only one.  8-)
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

Gnomi

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #3 am: 28. Jun 2019, 21:07 »
Definition of a demo:
Game demos come in two variations: playable and non-playable (also called a "rolling demo"). Playable demos generally have exactly the same gameplay as the upcoming full game, although game advancement is usually limited to a certain point, and occasionally some advanced features might be disabled. A non-playable demo is essentially the gaming equivalent of a teaser trailer.
[...] Generally, playable demos are stripped-down versions of the full game, restricting gameplay to some levels, only allowing access to some features, or limiting the amount of time playable in the game.

ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #4 am: 29. Jun 2019, 14:28 »
Basically, he did not have to give definition of demo because it is irrelevant. He could try to understand what I meant with demo and it would be very easy to understand as I already explained with examples. But instead of acting deferentially, a manner that looks down upon was used. Although that response does not deserve an answer, I will give that message a response as I respect users of this forum.

Actually as who read the messages can understand I was not using lexical meaning of demo but the attitude developed towards my message was as if I did not know what a demo is. Even though Wikipedia does not count as an proper source I will accept it this time, but it is more appropriate that trying not to use Wikipedia as a source next time to show forum members respect.

Present tense and generalization were used in the definition given. Also, words like generally, occasionally, might be, essentially and some levels are indicates that there is no certain description of demo that someone "should" make a demo according to it.

It can be deduced that game demos are for demonstration of games and what to demonstrate is up to someone who is making them. It is wrong to say that someone can not say what to expect from a demo as people play them before buying full versions.

Lastly, as the original game is not produced by Edain Team, it is not legally possible to release a kind of demo like in the given definition. More clearly, making a demo like it is not in the process of developing a "mod" because simply you can't sell it. That's why it irrelevant to give that definition in response to my message.

With respectful forum wishes,

Cheers.
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

FG15

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #5 am: 29. Jun 2019, 15:08 »
Basically, he did not have to give definition of demo because it is irrelevant. He could try to understand what I meant with demo and it would be very easy to understand as I already explained with examples.
I still have no clue what you exactly want. The closest thing to a demo would be 4.41 and it wouldn't make sense to request that, as you already can get it.

ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #6 am: 29. Jun 2019, 19:07 »
Hi FG15,

Thanks for your response. It is okay that you could not get what I "exactly" "want" as I did not "want" a "specific" thing. I just "offered" an idea that releasing a demo which includes what you can or want to put among what you did so far. I can not say put this and that because it would not be a proper request, that's why I gave examples. I can give more detailed one;

For example, you can include all faction updates together with siege ones so we can see multiplayer experience. Decision would be what to put in order to make such a demo playable.

I should say that it was just a suggestion which grounds on the though that you are already making tests so we can test the multiplayer part. If it is not convenient to release a demo or it is not a fit occasion for you or even you don't want to release one you can say "It is not convenient because of bla bla bla." I can understand. But the tone was used makes a person feels that there is no interest on the idea but there is an effort to refute it. An example of this is that after I gave examples, the definition of demo was written as a response. What is this? It makes this conversation argumentative but even if you make it argumentative it should be in an appropriate tone.

Since we already have come this far, I should also say that throughout 3 years we just read and I think it is normal to seek a playable version of it. Just relax. Nobody is here to judge you. There is an appreciation. Do not reverse it by writing that kind of responses or keeping people waiting too much.  :D

Cheers.
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

The_Necromancer0

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #7 am: 29. Jun 2019, 19:39 »
Making a demo at the current state would take longer than just finishing 4.5.

I do believe you've had your answer from the start.
Come chat Edain on Discord: https://discord.gg/CMhkeb8
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ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #8 am: 29. Jun 2019, 20:01 »
Making a demo at the current state would take longer than just finishing 4.5.

I do believe you've had your answer from the start.

No. It is not an answer as topic was not clearly understood.


Your message is not making a contribution to this topic as well. Why making a demo would take longer? Because may be he thinks a demo like the definition given?

I will write bongo instead of demo from now on. There is no need to create a bongo out of nothing as you already made a lot of changes and again:
I should say that it was just a suggestion which grounds on the though that you are already making tests so we can test the multiplayer part. If it is not convenient to release a demo or it is not a fit occasion for you or even you don't want to release one you can say "It is not convenient because of bla bla bla."

Have a nice weekend.

Peace.
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

Fellowship

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #9 am: 29. Jun 2019, 20:30 »
I'm pretty sure that what Gnomi means is that the next patch isn't too far away from being released, so it would be pointless to make a demo right now. ;)

ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #10 am: 29. Jun 2019, 20:34 »
I'm pretty sure that what Gnomi means is that the next patch isn't too far away from being released, so it would be pointless to make a demo right now. ;)

May be.  :)
"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."

Walküre

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #11 am: 30. Jun 2019, 17:06 »

I don't think that asking clarifications about the release or bringing proposals to the public's attention is a bad thing at all. I love when the forum actually performs its imperative function: answering people's doubts in the best of the ways. That's our task, after all :)

Therefore, I personally believe you need not assume such a defensive approach, if I may call it so, nor have I felt attacked or criticised by your comments either. The whole debate just gives me the impression that you're maybe over-complicating things too much, and said development of the discussion has probably diverted the focus from the main issue that was being addressed: irrespective of labels or terminology, only by sticking to the usual 'procedure' will the team accomplish each objective of their plan and, finally, hand to the community a fairly decent patch. Other alternative paths, whether it be a demo, a mini-demo, an open-source Beta, or a myriad of different options, would instead prove highly counterproductive and, methinks, illogical. People being eagerly awaiting the next revolution and every major overhaul embedded therein, is to me a quite self-explanatory reason not to present the Edain community with a flawed, half-completed update. I guess this is the point that Gnomi and FG were trying to explain to you.

Beside that, any further consideration on words or double meanings would simply result in an unproductive 'semantics game'; not really useful, I daresay. The same regarding the argumentative nature of a post or not. In other words, some convoluted, contrived, and theoretical constructions which only lead us astray and very far from what might otherwise be a noteworthy thread. It's similar to the response I gave you in the other topic, which was never meant to be an excuse or self-serving reminder. I've only noted how yours was just a plain direct statement, which neither specified nor provided many in-depth hints; it was a mere reaffirmation of the obvious, and the sheer passing of time is not an argument in itself, I think. Anyway, I'll close that twin-thread.

ElessarTelcontar

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Re: Road to Edain 4.5
« Antwort #12 am: 1. Jul 2019, 00:19 »
Hey Walküre,

Therefore, I personally believe you need not assume such a defensive approach, if I may call it so, nor have I felt attacked or criticised by your comments either.

I glad to hear that :) and thank you for giving the only answer here to my suggestion indicating your reservations. Even hearing about your reservations about releasing a bongo would be enough for me.


But again I should say that although neither Gnomi and FG have contributed an explanation nor I have started a 'semantics game', I agree with you that keeping up with joneses over semantics only leads us astray. That's why I was trying to explain how that attitude made me feel and why it was wrong. Also I did not get why did you think that I am over-complicating things while I am suggesting an idea leaving you everything to decide in the first place. I was not the one who wrote definitions but I am the one was trying to say that there are no frames you should be in.

Messages following after my second one make this thread about a different argument and I don't feel responsible for that but I think it is also productive in a different manner.

I will keep using bongo as I see the word demo can be associated with something different like a side product.

I've only noted how yours was just a plain direct statement, which neither specified nor provided many in-depth hints; it was a mere reaffirmation of the obvious, and the sheer passing of time is not an argument in itself, I think. Anyway, I'll close that twin-thread.

I have already answer that in the discussion forum indicating time is a relative concept. It fits me you have closed that thread but it was like a discussion and this thread contains a suggestion and that's why I don't think these two were twins.

The thing is when I made a suggestion it is plain or not there was an effort to directly refute it. And I don't know how I could say about 3 years differently or could provide more in-depth hints as I already indicated 30+ months have passed. I hope you understood why I wrote after my reply to that one. If you could not I can explain again.

Lastly, to return to the main subject I will say that I would not agree with you about releasing a bongo if there are too much time like 4+ months to release 4.5. I think it would be very productive to release one if the situation is like that. Also as nobody have to play a bongo if anyone wants to wait last version, one can wait for it. :)


Cheers.




"Be it a rock or a grain of sand, in water they sink as the same."