[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Dwarven Suggestions

Mithril mail mechanic.

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kmogon:

--- Zitat von: CaptainChunk! am  1. Apr 2020, 01:05 ---I had an idea for a change towards the traveling camp to make it a more interesting building to encourage the players to use it more often. My idea is to add a new ability that for a short period of time, your units will gain a small movement speed bonus and all production buildings a small resource output bonus as well. As I said it should be a small bonus to both move speed and resources and in a short period of time, as I could be easily exploited. My thoughts  behind the ability is that, travelers carry maps about the region they are traveling to/in, making them travel faster and since they could be delivering goods to one place to another, a faster travel of goods means more resources gained. That's just a suggestion, and I know it can have some problems in it, especially balance wise, and I would to love to know if there's any. :)

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--- Zitat von: Geethopapa am  1. Apr 2020, 11:32 ---First regarding travelling camp, we could give it a passive movement boost ability to units (only infantry and Heroes) in a wide radius around it, that way players would have an incentive to build them near where their units are. This also solves the problem of not being able to defend the traveling camp in time as players would most likely have units around the travelling camp, as it will be build in an area which will will see the most action. Just an idea.

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The speed buff could be certainly a good way to implement another usefullness of traveling camp. Yet we have to remeber that  that traveling camp is available for all dwarven subfactions. Due to that Ered Luin soldiers would benefit too much from any other speed increase they currently have. Additionlly they are faction which has the best statistics among other dwarven factions on edain ranked site. And that different is huge, even tho Erebor and Iron Hills dwarves units have better stats.
Because of that , what I think would be good idea before implementing any new concept of traveling camp , would be to decreaase normal speed to all Ered Luin troops to the speed of rest dwarven kingdoms and give them active power to temporary increase that speed. Then there could be some concepts for craveling cam being inplemented.
I also like an idea of traveling camps giving speed buff around them as that would allow player to make speed buff passages across maps and could be alternative for mine system. Although I not sure if only speed buff would be enough to make player build multiple traveling camps

Overall I'm glad you like the ideas and participate in the discussion  xD
 

Geethopapa:
Just an idea, what if the availability of the Mithril mail be tied to the Weapon arts of the Dwarves power? Like when you get the weapon art of the Dwarves, you unlock the Mithril mail upgrade in the heroes, for a certain cost,  just like how His deadly servants unlocks Nazgul upgrades.  It sort of fits as well as this power already boosts armor and damage of upgraded units. Also, weapon arts of the Dwarves can be made the central faction spell.

Also, what if the travelling camp's primary function be made something of a periodic unit summon building. Travelling warriors periodically summon at the travelling camp. Initially, randomly upgraded normal units come. Later in the game, maybe an option to call forth the veterans might be added in the camp, tied behind a particular spell book power or a certain prerequisite. Also, a few dwarves could be added to the travelling camp's vicinity that defend against attacks, like hobbits farms.

turin.turambar:
Heavily supporting the proposal, but I'd like to suggest a few tweaks here and there, resembling what others proposed, but being slightly different at the same time.

I don't think spending a unit to allow for an upgrade to be bought, especially if said upgrade is available only for heroes, is a good idea. Either the upgrade is too strong and it's OP or it's too weak and keeping the unit is better. While other proposal to travel camps are interesting, I'd propose in addition / replacement to the troops summoning ones that the ways to use the donkey is much expanded, making them a very essential unit of dwarves.

In addition to, as in the original proposal a give money possibility, they could send every Barack units traveling. Only elite units would return as veterans, but others units could either gain xp (possibly up to level 5), upgrades or become a different, better unit. (Or maybe a combination of these effect, I don't exactly know what would be balanced).

Dwarven heroes  would also gain their mithril  (or the possibility to get it, another balancing question) by using the donkeys. That would allow dwarves player to judge and decide HOW to use each of his donkeys, making for a meaningful choice.

kmogon:

--- Zitat von: Geethopapa am  1. Apr 2020, 16:08 ---Just an idea, what if the availability of the Mithril mail be tied to the Weapon arts of the Dwarves power? Like when you get the weapon art of the Dwarves, you unlock the Mithril mail upgrade in the heroes, for a certain cost,  just like how His deadly servants unlocks Nazgul upgrades.  It sort of fits as well as this power already boosts armor and damage of upgraded units. Also, weapon arts of the Dwarves can be made the central faction spell.

Also, what if the travelling camp's primary function be made something of a periodic unit summon building. Travelling warriors periodically summon at the travelling camp. Initially, randomly upgraded normal units come. Later in the game, maybe an option to call forth the veterans might be added in the camp, tied behind a particular spell book power or a certain prerequisite. Also, a few dwarves could be added to the travelling camp's vicinity that defend against attacks, like hobbits farms.

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The problem I see with both ideas is that they are quite similar to already inmplemented mechanics in Gondor and Mordor. I don't mind making Art of dwarves spell maybe a bit more interesting , but passive ability which grants heroes possibility to buy new armor ( and maybe some new skill ) is what Mordor has exacly. Especially if art of dwarves would become a central spell. Moreover it would also take away one reason to buy traveling camp as veterans would no longer serve as mithril smiths.

About traveling camp idea I also think that it is too similar to what Gondor beacons have to offer. Also there should be need to keep their lore thematics. Those camps sybolize dwarven journeys across middle earth in order to sell their goods or visit their old kingdoms , so they are not exacly the raly point of dwarven forces.
Although I think that idea of some dwarven warriors wandering around traveling camps would be a good one, depends on what role it would be having.


--- Zitat von: turin.turambar am  8. Apr 2020, 22:20 ---I don't think spending a unit to allow for an upgrade to be bought, especially if said upgrade is available only for heroes, is a good idea. Either the upgrade is too strong and it's OP or it's too weak and keeping the unit is better. While other proposal to travel camps are interesting, I'd propose in addition / replacement to the troops summoning ones that the ways to use the donkey is much expanded, making them a very essential unit of dwarves.

In addition to, as in the original proposal a give money possibility, they could send every Barack units traveling. Only elite units would return as veterans, but others units could either gain xp (possibly up to level 5), upgrades or become a different, better unit. (Or maybe a combination of these effect, I don't exactly know what would be balanced).

Dwarven heroes  would also gain their mithril  (or the possibility to get it, another balancing question) by using the donkeys. That would allow dwarves player to judge and decide HOW to use each of his donkeys, making for a meaningful choice.

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The strength of mithril mail upgrade would need to be checked first , in my opinion , as it isn't used too much in multiplayer matches.
Even though ability for all units to use ponies and gain different effects sounds realy interesting , I think that we should focus more on the real thematic of that change. I'm not sure if ponies should have that much of significance in the faction , or if yes , then it shouldn't be so focused on military aspect. Traveling camp, in my eyes , represents all those dwarven merchants which travels around the middle earth in order to trade their goods. That's why I would be glad to see them as some kind of economic buildings with that second role in a shape of traveling to the khazad dum.

Geethopapa:
@kmogon : I kind of like the idea that the travelling camp should primarily reflect the dwarven merchants travelling through the middle earth to sell dwarven goods and crafts. So basically a resource structure early on.

But currently Dwarven mineshafts are so important to the Dwarves, especially Erebor and IH, that still with the speed boost passive given to the Travel camp, it might not still be preferable to mineshafts.

Also, as you mentioned the aspect of dwarves travelling to their other kingdoms through travel camps, it could be implemented in terms of a passive decrease to the spell powers cooldowns, the more travel camp are on the field, the faster cooldowns on spells.

Another idea, travel camp could reduce the Supply route penalty for the dwarven RBs. 

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