Misty Mountains Balance Suggestions

[Elendils Cousin 3. Grades]

In this thread, you can discuss balancing issues with the Misty Mountains faction. If you feel a balance topic is so big it deserves its own thread, you're free to create one, but for smaller points this thread might be useful.

[ProfXavier]

Hi guys,
as suggested by Necro, I want to suggest some changes for this faction. We have been playing 2v2's at the office for almost a year everyday and we feel like this needs some changes. The newest of the 4 players, and also the worst, uses Misty Mountains and is unbeateable so there is definitely an issue with balance.

The issue:
-Spam of diverse, cheap, and extremely effective units. Misty has access to several types of units early game, which, in combination, is extremely effective. To add to this problem, they have an economic building they can place and protect near their base, making it easy and effective to just spam units against rivals. Settlements can spawn units so just hotkey from 3 to 0, place down flags, spam goblins and wargs, add in Trolls to the mix and its game over. We have tried several tacticts against the Trolls but they accelerate quick, move extremely fast, and are just too strong, even pikemen take a lot of time to mow them down. The issue is the MM player can just move the trolls around, have their enemy chase them, while goblins and wargs finish them. If you dont chase them around, you have several trolls throwing rocks and demolishing your army.

How could this be balanced without affecting the essence of the faction (spam)? I would say that trolls need to be slowed down in speed, take more time to start moving, and take more time to start throwing rocks. All 3 attributes are ridiculously fast, making them absolute units. When confronted by pikes they should also slow down, its too easy for them to move around pikes, kiting enemies while having your other units attacking them. I also think wargs should be 400 points not 300. Cheap cavalry early game is insanely overpowered. Misty players dont care about points as they are swimming in them, they can spam wargs without caring if they run into pikes and suicide as they are way to cheap. Maybe even 500. As for the buildings, perhaps it should be a bit more expensive to pop the first tunnel, its very hard to destroy if you place it near your base, and it gives an economic boost that supports your spamming of the above mentioned tough-to-deal-with units.

I added a replay, its not the best as my team mate (angmar) is not doing very good at 1K start. I will try to get a better one today.

[Halbarad]

Hey,
just looked into your replay. Its tough playing with Angmar against Misty Mountains in 1vs1, but with a few changes in strategy you could have turned that around.

So here are a few tips from me:
1. If he has trolls behind his front lines, you cant just send single bataillons of hillmen-pikes after them. Of course they get crushed by his infantry and wargs. You can also spam and you can also kill his units from far away with axe-throwers, however...
2. You never recruited archers from Carn Dûm even though you were able to do it. Trolls are weak against archers but strong against attacks from swords. And the damage Hillmen-Ax-Throwers counts as the latter. So go for archers, for later you may go for heroes like Helegwen (idk how strong Gulzar is, but he also has high ranged attack).
3. You have problem with the spam? He didnt go for any pikes and Angmar can get its cavalry really fast and just whipe away the orc-spam and catch a running Orc-chieftain.


In the earlygame you did push him, however he got saved by his ally Gondor. Otherwise, trollmoney and the battle would have been yours, maybe the hero too. There are also a few ways to optimize your start: Dont instantly recruit 2 units in your hall of the king at once, get the second one in the moment the first one is coming out of the hall of the kings. In between, you can use the money to get more farms. Go directly for the troll, it gives you more money then orcs and a huge early advantage. Misty Mountains cant directly go for the troll because they dont have the pikes. Trolls get easy killed when walking through pikes (they also die when walking through swordsmen) due to crush-revenge damage. Use that and lure them into your units. Use Drauglin for that, also you should always get him because he is worth his money and can catch units/ heroes that are running from you like his goblin archer when you won the battle in the early game.


I hope that helped and wish you good luck!

[ProfXavier]

Hey Halbarad,
that was not a great match to add. The tips for Angmar are good. Fabringio will try to use them. Can you suggest factions and strategies to deal with MM?

[Halbarad]

If I remember correctly, Rohan was the stronges faction when facing misty mountains. You can spam units of your own which dominate when fighting simple orcs, especially when protecting farms (since they gain extra defense). By going for an exile camp, you can go for early cav to destroy the enemies spam. Farms gain permanent protection from single unit raids by using the left spell. Gamling is an archer hero on horse, which means that he can outrun the trolls and attack them from afar. Also he adds units to your spam.
Later on, if you get Erkenbrand and let him summon pikes, you can summon a bataillon of pikes into the enemies trolls.

[Elendils Cousin 3. Grades]

The big advantage Rohan has in this matchup are the heroes on horseback. Start by getting enough peasants to fight against the spam, get some cavalry to force out pikes from MM, then get Eowyn/Eomer/Theoden/Hama out. Grouped together, they can hunt trolls, heroes and other high priority targets while forcing MM to group up around more and more pikes, making it easier for you to fight with peasants and eventually Rohirrim Archers. With decent micro, you should never lose these heroes, gaining constant value with them. Just look out for the Defiler's knockback.