[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Dwarven Suggestions

New Iron Hills Unique Siege Weapon

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Gandalf The Gray:
the chain is unrealistic he says the flying lizard that breaths fire its ok xD

Fredius:
Now now let's calm down a bit everyone.

Korner this is just a discussion topic, Dain is not demanding that he wants those chains into the mod, he just gives ideas about how they COULD be used, but that doesn't mean that the team has to agree with every idea he has. Ofcourse you can disagree with these ideas, but you don't have to call some aspects "stupid". For God's sake they are just chains :D.

My opinion about the chains is that they certainly are awesome, but I don't think it's possible to include them, because the Engine does not support this. That's why I don't think we will get it anyway, even if the Edain Team wants it.

Now I forgot something very important when I mentioned the historical use of Ballistas. We are talking about giant Iron Ballistas right now, with bolts two times bigger and heavier than the average human being. They are similair to the Isengard Ballistas, who also deal great damage to buildings, so why not give the Iron Hills Ballistas the same amount of power as Isengard? That way we can also replace the Catapult, instead of having two siege weapons with the same function. I played with the Ered Mithrin Catapult and overestimated their strength, they are not particulary strong against buildings, so they are not a good alternative. But I can live with the idea of using Fortress Extention Ballistas, that too sounds awesome.


--- Zitat von: Der Dunkle König am  1. Nov 2015, 23:38 ---I'm completly against implementing these chains. In my opinion they are unrealistic and don't serve a real purpose.
You say that these chains are awesome. But in my opinion that's the problem: They were added to the movie, because they look awesome, just like many other things in the Hobbit movies. But there is no other reason for their existance than that. To look good shouldn't be a reason for adding something to a movie or a mod.

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Yeah only you forget that at the siege of Helms Deep they added crossbowmen and even Galadhrim, who are not mentioned in the books either, but they "just look awesome". I don't see you complaining about the LOTR movies in that aspect.

Walküre:
I completely agree with Fredius.
This is a thread meant for discussion, and everyone is supposed to express, in the best way possible, its own ideas, using the most convincing and solid reasons one could.
I'm quite sure that none of us wants another unnecessary fight to take place here, on the Dwarven Section.

The usage of words like 'stupid', 'boring', 'damn' or other similar things is indeed not helpful at all for the sake of a free discussion, with the risk of creating other 'heated scenarios'.
Please, as it was also suggested numerous times in other threads, try to always avoid them; there will surely be other 'effective' and constructive ways to express your own disagreement  :)


--- Zitat von: korner am  1. Nov 2015, 23:30 ---
--- Zitat von: Gandalf The Gray am  1. Nov 2015, 23:26 ---i think the chain idea is awesome

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agree. Gandalf should have a buff


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Furthermore, what's the point of this?

Der Dunkle König:

--- Zitat von: Fredius am  2. Nov 2015, 01:11 ---
--- Zitat von: Der Dunkle König am  1. Nov 2015, 23:38 ---I'm completly against implementing these chains. In my opinion they are unrealistic and don't serve a real purpose.
You say that these chains are awesome. But in my opinion that's the problem: They were added to the movie, because they look awesome, just like many other things in the Hobbit movies. But there is no other reason for their existance than that. To look good shouldn't be a reason for adding something to a movie or a mod.

--- Ende Zitat ---

Yeah only you forget that at the siege of Helms Deep they added crossbowmen and even Galadhrim, who are not mentioned in the books either, but they "just look awesome". I don't see you complaining about the LOTR movies in that aspect.

--- Ende Zitat ---
Sorry, did I ever say anything about the books? The crossbowmen were added to Isengard, because it would have been stupid for the army of Isengard not to have a weapon against the archers on the wall of Helms Deep. In fact, archers and spear-throwers of Isengard were mentioned in the books. They were replaced by crossbowmen to show that Isengard is technologically advanced.
The Galadhrim are a bit more difficult: I think they were added because of dramaturgic reasons. Peter Jackson (or somebody else, I don't know) didn't want the elves to do nothing. They should have their role in the story and not just sit in Lorien and don't care about anything. I don't think that they were added because they look good.

And even if I couldn't convince you about they difference between crossbows/Galadhrim and ballistas: Your argument ist invalid. I could critizise the ballistas for being added because of their appearence and I could do the same with the Galadhrim. How did you know that I like the Galadhrim when you wrote your post? I never said anything about them. I didn't say if I like them now.


--- Zitat von: Gandalf The Gray am  2. Nov 2015, 01:08 ---the chain is unrealistic he says the flying lizard that breaths fire its ok xD

--- Ende Zitat ---

When you want to create a fantasy universe, you should define what is possible and what not. As I see ist Tolkien took our world and added magic and dragons and orcs and so on to it. But the laws of physic are still valid. And in my opinion these chain-bolt can't work with these laws.
You could replace the word "realism" with "consistence". In the Lord of the Rings some laws of physics are obviously the same as in our world, so, for example, how can Legolas jump over rocks that are falling down?

LordDainIronfoot:
Isengard had Ballistas so whats the problem of Dwarves having Ballistas even without the Chain Bolts!?
PJ added Elves for the dramatic effect and to show that Elves actualyl take part in the War for the same reason he could have send Dwarves from Erebor there? But that aside,PJ added the Dwarven Ballistas to show the inovative and engeering thinking and skills of the Dwarves,since as WETA stated Tolkien do not give full and complete discription of the Iron Hilsl Army and Aramement but rather describes a small Contingent of 500 Elite Veterans and I am avsolutely sure those weren't the Main nor the Whole Iron Hills Army,so PJ and WETA decided to create the culture and the army ofthe Iron Hills to its fullet jsut because Tolkien left a gap there! :)

The use of those Chains is not absolutely and completely impossible!With right engeneering and craftsmanship it is possible but may be with smaller range! :) But we discussed this long time ago and I do not wish to start over again so as I said in my previous comment lets continue the discussion for how and should be the Ballistas included but without the Chains!? :)

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