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Edain 4.4: General Feedback

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Hamanathnath:
Yeah, Ered Luin is the best right now.  Though Iron hills is a close second for me.  Erebor seems to be the one that is underwhelming (and by that, I mean actually balanced.  Ered Luin and Iron Hills could use some nerfs IMO.)

lahe95:
When AI ring hero picks up the ring, the ring hero goes back to the base and just camps there. Only attacks when I attack the base.

Garlodur:
Hello people of Edain,

I hope this is the best place to give some feedback of the latest patch 4.4.1. I have done a playthrough of all factions against Imladris, as well as the reverse, and I wanted to share my 'findings'. I do not pretend that I am a great player but AI Brutal enemies are no problem in general. I have no experience playing online, and I know that balancing the game is mainly aimed at that aspect of the mod. Nonetheless, I feel that these observations must be shared.

Map used: Westfold (castles)
Starting resources: 4000
Ring Heroes on
Custom heroes off

Playing Imladris against Brutal AI
Against Gondor it was difficult to hold up against the continuous spam of soldiers, pikemen, archers, and at some point rangers and tower guards. Imladris infantry deal with most units as long as they are supported by archers on walls; defensive play is elemental here. Imladris Lancers are not particularly strong as they get stuck quite quickly, and are very vulnerable to pikes due to their small battalion size. Heroes are easily dealt with and own heroes will mostly survive if used in unison: Arwen is key to having a strong force of heroes pushing back the enemy (true in all games).
Playing against Arnor was easier (on Springs of Mitheitel map), because they lack elite spears. Cavalry worked much better to harass enemy farms and pull his attention away from sieging my castle.
Against the Dwarves of Erebor and the Iron Hills it seemed that the AI could not build up his forces or transport them over the battlefield quickly enough. This meant that the superior Imladris infantry slays incoming battalions with ease. The Dwarves of Ered Luin had none of these issues and made some serious dents in the infantry (melee warriors had equal standoffs, while archers shot from long distances). Good use of cavalry roaming the map, while my main army was aided by the Dúnedain, pinned the Dwarves down quickly.
Against Rohan there is only one answer against peasants: Blademasters and heroes.
Playing against Lothlorien required very defensive play as Imladris infantry are crushed by hordes of archers, soldiers, but especially Beorningers. Luckily, archers on the wall take care of everything that attempts passage, including Ents, but excepting their heroes.
Against Mordor I had a bit of a hard time because cavalry were of zero use against such hordes. The amount of debuffs Nazguls and spells offer Mordor makes it difficult to make a succesfull push towards the enemy base. Morgul Orcs have quite a chance against Imladris infantry but only supported by such debuffs and Trolls.
Against Isengard Imladris Lancers worked extremely well, as long as they did not get caved in by Wildmen. Archers defended my castle against everything with ease, while my main army marched forth and defeated all enemies. The Isengard castle is almost impossible to siege due to the high amount of defensive towers with Steel Bolts that deal immense damage even against upgraded infantry.
Against Angmar I experienced most difficulty due to the high amount of crowd control spells, and the endless hordes of Thralls with support from the Men of Carn Dûm. My infantry army was eradicated many times, my cavalry was useless, and the Dúnedain were of little use because after cutting through Thralls, the Men of Carn Dum were awaiting. Longest game of all.

All factions against Brutal Imladris
With Gondor it was not too difficult fighting Imladris using Denethor, Tower Guard, and Gondor Archers. My defensive start did not need to stand long and siege was relatively easy.
With Arnor it was in some ways easier, altough the actual siege was incredibly tough. Upgraded Arnor Guardian elite swordsmen take well care of all types of Imladris infantry, and so do the Arnor Rangers. From mid-game on I controlled the battlefield with one large army of all units and a few heroes that had no problem with anything the AI sent, until I started my siege and all units were decimated by the Imladris castle towers.
Regarding Dwarves of Erebor and Iron Hills I have to say that it is incredibly difficult to stand a chance against Imladris; I lost only these two games. They are slow, their elite is no match for Imladris infantry, and the heroes (Iron Hills) are too slow and are pointless against Imladris cavalry. I have to admit that I used the Tunnel Network wrong here: instead of anticipating an attack on farms, I waited till enemy units had already gathered and the issue of my clumped units made them easy targets. This cost me many battalions and heroes. The Dwarves of Ered Luin had an easy time against Imladris for reasons explained in the reverse stand-off, plus the fact that their heroes are very strong.
Playing Rohan against Imladris I expected to be tough, but my cavalry was extremely useful in this case, in contrast to a peasant spam or the Captain's elite units. Important here was to wait for spells and siege to make a final push.
Lothlorien proved to be an exciting match, two folks of Elves against each other. The Beornings did their job well, my archers were outstanding at range, and the Galadhrim were ruthless against many hordes of Imladris swordsmen (although not too many at a time). The siege of Imladris castle itself was a pain as Ents are vulnerable against the wall arrow towers.
Mordor against Imladris is quite simple: use endless hordes of Orcs combined with Trolls and no Nazgul need to stain their robes.  ;)
Playing Isengard was quite tough as they lack leaderships that improve siege combat. Even upgraded Uruks are weak against arrow towers, but with Wildmen molesting continuously the enemy AI is weakened by a lack of resources. I guessed Mines would not get inside the castle without dying so I predicted this to be barely viable; I haven't tried this however.
Angmar needs to focus on late game against Imladris, leading a force of Carn Dum with a few Werewolves led by Mornamarth and Helegwen to start a long siege. Even though I broke down half the wall, I lost my whole army destroying the inside buildings. 

In short, I feel that Imladris is a great faction with very unique gameplay mechanics. They usually survive early game and from then on it becomes fairly easy as I worked on keeping units alive and upgrading them to the fullest. On Lore Masters I have to say that they inhabit a special position: having them against you they are mostly annoying because of their numbers (the Brutal AI's beautiful tactical insight here), but when using them myselves I found them painfully weak and not game changing at all.

Lastly, I want to make a quick note on Heroic Units: they are not strong in the current version. Due to their small battalions and slow revival rate they don't survive mass engagements. They are often the AI's first target if no heroes are present, and seem to cost too much trouble for their price compared to a high number of standard units for the same price.

Again, I hope these small observations help the Edain Team with balancing. Fortunately the siege aspect is on the table and I see many improvements coming in already.

Keep up the fantastic work!

DrHouse:
hello! I am new, thanks for your great work :), amazing!

by the way, i want to report some little problems in order to help you!
- sometimes Dwalin is bugged and can't attack units (after using his powerful blow)
- against lothlorien, is difficult for catapults to hit structures, i always hit the catwalk instead
- does the ring can be pick up only by ring heroes? it's different from preview versions, true?

very very good work, i love it!!

ps is there a place where i can find units' values or something else, in order, for example, to know if outpost units are better or not, thank you :)

DaGeggo:

--- Zitat ---- does the ring can be pick up only by ring heroes? it's different from preview versions, true?
--- Ende Zitat ---
Yes, it also stands in the description of the ringusage if you look at your citadell :D.


--- Zitat ---ps is there a place where i can find units' values or something else, in order, for example, to know if outpost units are better or not, thank you
--- Ende Zitat ---
There actually is the Edain mod searcher, in witch you can find all the values you are looking for. A great program! The only thing is that Im not completely sure if it supports english completely yet, but there is a english version to wich you can switch in the Searcher.
https://modding-union.com/index.php/topic,33200.msg436451.html#msg436451

PS: There are extra threads for Bugs proposal etc. Just look in the Edain Mod index.

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