[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] General Suggestions

Smaug, the Chiefest and Greatest of Calamities

<< < (19/26) > >>

The Witch-King of Angmar:
Wonderful suggestion I like the whole thing, count me in +1

AulëTheSmith:
Then I'll put your name in the green list, Wielder of the Iron Crown!! xD thank you for your support :)

Garlodur:
You are both completely right Aulë and Walk. The topic should focus on the core of the concept, the abilities and details are of later importance.

Thus I wanted to address a few things I noticed while reading through the first page proposal again.

First, there seem to be 6 abilities in both Smaug forms, including one for landing and for taking flight. Is this on purpose? I imagine it would be interesting to have the stances button work in this aspect, but on the other side it grants a strong mass-slayer hero more ability slots, which should be balanced out in the end by making his abilities relatively weaker.

Second, the Dragon Lair aspect needs some refinement. I assume it will be built on an outpost spot, which begs the question what other purposes it fulfills. Also, we need to determine its style: will it be like the Dale village, Mirkwood or Border Stronghold? Or perhaps a design unique to the Goblin playstyle, offering straightforward and simple gameplay? With that in mind we can establish the cost of the outpost, which has direct consequences for the strategic timing of the Tribute system, and indirectly to Smaug's strength.

Personally I would like to see the Misty Mountains as an uncomplicated faction which gets many of its upgrades, buffs, leadership and building levels through instantaneous and temporary means. This should offer an interesting contrast to factions that are strong throughout all phases of the game (Dwarves and Lórien), as well as to factions that build up power till a late game climax (Isengard and Imladris).

What this means for the Dragon Lair outpost in particular, and the central spell for the Misty Mountains in general, is a clear distinction between the different stages of upgraded creep lairs. So far we know the Misty Mountains builds Warg/Wolf lairs and Troll Caves on settlements, and two outposts related to Dragons and Mountain Giants. These buildings will offer two-tiered advantages to the player: initially they will produce resources and recruit corresponding monsters, in the second phase they offer buffs or unlock certain units.

The Dragon Lair recruits Fire Drakes (perhaps Cold Drakes too, if a niche is found for them) and produces medium resources in the beginning. As the Central Spell is unlocked the Drakes can be upgraded through the system known from 3.8 growing up with wings etc. (correct me if I'm wrong here, I haven't played this version). Additionally Smaug can be summoned through tributes. As for Smaug I would propose these tributes to unlock a certain abilities rather than increase his level, because it seems more simple to me and because it allows for making the Tribute System feel more necessary. Thus it is worthwhile investing in all 'steps' of tributes, because they unlock 3-4 of his abilities.

I hope this inspires you Aulë. I promise to keep a frequent eye out on the developments here  ;)

AulëTheSmith:

--- Zitat von: Garlodur am 14. Jan 2018, 18:30 ---You are both completely right Aulë and Walk. The topic should focus on the core of the concept, the abilities and details are of later importance.

Thus I wanted to address a few things I noticed while reading through the first page proposal again.

First, there seem to be 6 abilities in both Smaug forms, including one for landing and for taking flight. Is this on purpose? I imagine it would be interesting to have the stances button work in this aspect, but on the other side it grants a strong mass-slayer hero more ability slots, which should be balanced out in the end by making his abilities relatively weaker.

Second, the Dragon Lair aspect needs some refinement. I assume it will be built on an outpost spot, which begs the question what other purposes it fulfills. Also, we need to determine its style: will it be like the Dale village, Mirkwood or Border Stronghold? Or perhaps a design unique to the Goblin playstyle, offering straightforward and simple gameplay? With that in mind we can establish the cost of the outpost, which has direct consequences for the strategic timing of the Tribute system, and indirectly to Smaug's strength.

Personally I would like to see the Misty Mountains as an uncomplicated faction which gets many of its upgrades, buffs, leadership and building levels through instantaneous and temporary means. This should offer an interesting contrast to factions that are strong throughout all phases of the game (Dwarves and Lórien), as well as to factions that build up power till a late game climax (Isengard and Imladris).

What this means for the Dragon Lair outpost in particular, and the central spell for the Misty Mountains in general, is a clear distinction between the different stages of upgraded creep lairs. So far we know the Misty Mountains builds Warg/Wolf lairs and Troll Caves on settlements, and two outposts related to Dragons and Mountain Giants. These buildings will offer two-tiered advantages to the player: initially they will produce resources and recruit corresponding monsters, in the second phase they offer buffs or unlock certain units.

The Dragon Lair recruits Fire Drakes (perhaps Cold Drakes too, if a niche is found for them) and produces medium resources in the beginning. As the Central Spell is unlocked the Drakes can be upgraded through the system known from 3.8 growing up with wings etc. (correct me if I'm wrong here, I haven't played this version). Additionally Smaug can be summoned through tributes. As for Smaug I would propose these tributes to unlock a certain abilities rather than increase his level, because it seems more simple to me and because it allows for making the Tribute System feel more necessary. Thus it is worthwhile investing in all 'steps' of tributes, because they unlock 3-4 of his abilities.

I hope this inspires you Aulë. I promise to keep a frequent eye out on the developments here  ;)

--- Ende Zitat ---

Hi Garlodur, i'm happy you finally come to the thread again, really :)
No, i admit that it was not intentional, but we could definely consider the stance system with the two landing/flying optionas. I find it a good idea. Smaug, after all doesn't really need the three classical stances :) it's true that in this way we had an additional ability, but it also true that one of them i add is passive and influence the armor only ("Impenetrable Armor"), even if in significantly (a suppose +50% it will change his armor in a punchy way, it requires testing to be sure and set a proper value) :). IN the end i like the proposal of making it stance system. I shall insert it in da concept  ;)

I hope it will be in the way you described, troll and wolves in settlements, and more powerful creatures (Giants and Dragons), in outpost. At the beginning i remember i considered the Dragon lair as based on levels, and this is what i put in the main concept, since it matches better with my idea of tributes system. But, now that i'm thinking better, the outpost usually they are not bind to any levels. I'm a little bit torn inside about how to imporve the tributes and dragon lair, despite i'm still sure about unlocking more powerful creature after the central spell, like windged dragon and cold drakes for examples (it could turn also to 6 points of cost, if 5 will be judged as too low balance-wise). Cold-drakes could be strong against structures (like short range siege weapons,thus absolving the same role of battering-rams), winged dragons against units, and so on. I'm just throwing ideas :)

I like your general ideas about dragon lair and i invite you to better develop them, posting them here when they will be ready, take your time of course. I'm look forward to discuss :) 

Walküre:
Due to the own proposal getting more than 15 votes of approval, as it used to be customary in the past, I shall hereafter include it among the other major concepts of our forum, worthy of considerable note. I'm glad that another proposal joins the family of the Fantastic Four, as I call them. Nevertheless, I hope that what is to be will in fact be well-boding for the purpose of our concerted effort :)

May I also thank all of those who have contributed greatly for the cause and made sure that a really fruitful debate was possible in the politest terms; and I would stress the latter, lest nothing good could result from all of this. It will obviously be possible to garner additional support or negative feedback. The thread will remain open to all.

Navigation

[0] Themen-Index

[#] Nächste Seite

[*] Vorherige Sete