Imrahil - Prince of Dol Amroth

• Imrahil - Prince of Dol Amroth von OakenShield224 am 06 Okt, 2018 13:47
• Hello everyone. Today I’d like to talk about one of the least used heroes in the mod: Imrahil. At the moment, he’s only ever useful when using beacons but, as beacons are so underused currently, Imrahil is hardly ever seen. I know that Fiefdoms will be seeing some changes in 4.5 which will hopefully make them more useful. However, while Imrahil’s abilities are interesting, they in general just aren’t as effective as they should be. To add to that his Atheling Guard are quite possibly the weakest heroic units in the game.
  Overall, the Imrahil in the mod doesn’t fit the figure described to us in the books of a heroic, inspiring leader who led Minas Tirith’s forces during the siege and was praised by so many. This is why I have come up with a proposal on how Imrahil could be:
  
  Level 1: Mount/Dismount – switch between mounted and on foot
  
  Level 1: Prince of Dol Amroth - changes to a support palantir where Imrahil can adjust the strategy to adapt any situation and ensure his troops at prepared for battle:
   - Standard tactics - Soldiers of the fiefdoms near Imrahil will be granted +15% attack power as well as armor by this leadership.
   - Aggressive tactics - This leadership grants +30% attack power to soldiers of the fiefdoms near Imrahil.
   - Defensive tactics - this leadership grants +30% defence to soldiers of the fiefdoms near Imrahil.
   - To Gondor's Aid (needs level 3)- Imrahil brings support to Minas Tirith in its time of need. Select a target Border Stronghold to give it a permanent bonus. Repeatedly selecting a Stronghold will improve it further:
     First Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops are recruited 20% faster
     Second Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops can be recruited for 75% of their original price
     Third Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops are recruited with heavy armour
  
  Originally I was going to have the ability improve the beacons, but I was told that it would be redundant with the 4.5 changes to the beacons. Therefore, it now affects the Dol Amroth troops. This fits with the idea of Imrahil as the person who brought aid to Minas Tirith before the siege and probably prepared his troops well before doing so. By having it be multiple upgrades, it would prevent the ability from becoming too overpowered at once, requiring extra time before you can use it to it's full potential.
  
  Level 5: For Honour - Imrahil and his troops dash through enemy lines, treading their foes under the hooves of their mighty horses. Imrahil and nearby cavalry will have -25% crush reduction for 30 seconds
  
  While the idea of this ability is good in 4.4.1, in practice it isn't very effective. My change is to have it also affect nearby cavalry which shouldn't be too OP as it isn't a massive buff like Theoden's Glorious Charge. It is a reference to the charge of Dol Amroth when rescuing Faramir and his men before the Siege of Gondor.
  
  Level 8: Atheling Guard – Imrahil summons his atheling guard from Dol Amroth to his side. The Atheling Guard allow Imrahil to recharge his abilities 33% faster and grant him +15% armour as long as they remain close together. If the Guard is summoned while Imrahil is mounted, the Guard will be mounted. If the Guard is summoned while Imrahil is on foot, the Guard will be on foot. Only 1 battalion can be summoned at the same time. They are summoned at level 1 and can gain experience.
  
  As said before, the Atheling Guard are the worst heroic unit in game. Their smaller batallion size makes them more vulnerable, and Imrahil's abilities aren't useful enough to justify their passive or their status as a level 10 power for an outpost hero. I've buffed them by having them improve Imrahil's armour and also by making them a level 8 power.
  
  
  Level 10: Discipline - in Gondor's darkest hour, Imrahil temporarily takes command of its armies. For 30 seconds, his leadership will affect all allied troops as well as fiefdoms troops. Dol Amroth troops will heal themselves after every attack. All nearby non-Dol Amroth troops gain +50% experience.
  
  The current Discipline is a good idea in theory, but not effective in execution. With the changes I've made to it, the ability will show off the strong and inspiring leader that Imrahil was during the Siege, granting a temporary buff to all nearby troops.
  
  I hope that you will like these changes and that they would turn a rarely seen hero into one that is worth it! Any feedback is welcome. Thanks to Necro, Julio229, and Samsara for helping with a couple of abilities and stopping the proposal from being redundant with the 4.5 fiefdoms changes.
  
  In Favour
  Julio299
  AulëTheSmith
  Smeargollum
  Necro
  NoldorSithLordsShipwrigh t
  Isildurs Fluch
  Seleukos I.
  Tiberius Ogden
  
  
  Edit: moved the leadership palantir back to how it orignally was after Gnomi's feedback. Added To Gondor's Aid to this palantir, since the ability doesn't need to be used in combat situations. Thanks to Necro for this idea.
  Edit 2: changed the buffs for To Gondor's Aid to make it a bit more balanced and changed the formatting a little bit.
• #1 von Julio229 am 06 Okt, 2018 14:34
• I agree that Imrahil is kinda underused in 4.4.1, and this change would certainly make him be overall more useful, while retaining his capabilities and overhauling the ones that weren't all that good. It will also reflect his character better than the previous version did. Overall, I'm in favour of this suggestion!
• #2 von AulëTheSmith am 06 Okt, 2018 15:38
• I've used him very few times because of the reasons you stated. I like that you included his leadership in the stance system (much more useful like this than the classic three stances). I like the changes overall, he's much more effective in your concept. Therefore, my dear Oaken, you got a capital YES from me 
• #3 von Smeargollum am 06 Okt, 2018 17:02
• I think that all of your suggestions are very cool and lore-frendly. But I don't know if the hero might be a littel bit strong because the beacons troops get an revision in the next version whitch will probably buff them and if we add also an poverfull supporter it could be to strong. Also the leaderships of Aragorn, Boromir and Faramir efects them and then plus the new Imrahil... I don't know. But I think when it is not op it would very nice to give Imrahil youre new abilitys.
  So all over I like youre idea!
  Have a nice day!
  Smeargollum
• #4 von The_Necromancer0 am 06 Okt, 2018 17:29
• Very much agree with this system. My only comment is the stance system. I'm not sure whether it is still wise to keep the original stance as it might deter users from changing the buff if it also put Imrahil at risk. For example if he is engaged in combat against a strong foe, changing him to aggressive stance to buff the troops would also result in him taking more damage. Just food for thought.
  
  Overall, as I've stated previously, this is going to make Imrahil a mighty hero in my opinion. He might even need a price increase 
  
  Heavily in favour
• #5 von NoldorSithLordsShipwright am 07 Okt, 2018 04:39
• I agree that Imrahil as currently implemented is quite underwhelming compared to how he is described in the books. I feel that this would definitely make Imrahil a better, less gimmicky part of Gondor's hero roster.
  
  I am in favor.
• #6 von Isildurs Fluch am 07 Okt, 2018 12:46
• I´m also in favor of this pruposal...
• #7 von OakenShield224 am 07 Okt, 2018 12:56
• Thanks for the support! For balance, the numbers can be changed later on if it is too overpowered. My concern was mainly to make Imrahil a worthwhile purchase. As Necro said, a price increase could also be applied if Imrahil becomes too strong.
  
  As for the stance system, the way I see it, it isn't too different from Thranduil's system. The main difference being that Thranduil's affects himself, while Imrahil's affects others around him. It would mainly encourage users of Imrahil to be slightly more cautious if they want to make the best use of the bigger buffs.
• #8 von Gnomi am 07 Okt, 2018 13:22
• I don't think that you can use the stance systems flawlessly for leaderships.
  
  Leaderhips normale reset every 1 second and last at least 2 seconds.
  Otherwise it would cause problems, as it could happen that you loose the leadership for a short period of time. (less than 1 second is also problematic, as it causes bugs).
  Also I think that there can't be a (visible) cooldown for switching between  the stances.
  That means taht you can constantly have 2 or even all 3 leaderships at once, if you just switch constantly between the stances.
• #9 von OakenShield224 am 07 Okt, 2018 14:20
• Edited the original post with an idea to have "To Gondor's Aid" be included in his current leadership palantir to avoid technical and balance issues with the stances.
• #10 von Seleukos I. am 07 Okt, 2018 17:07
• Hello all together,
  I haye to say I really like that idea.
  With one exeption:
  

  Zitat

  - To Gondor's Aid (needs level 3)- Imrahil brings support to Minas Tirith in its time of need. Select a target Border Stronghold to give it a permanent bonus. Repeatedly selecting a Stronghold will improve it further:
     First Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops are recruited with forged blades
     Second Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops are recruited with heavy armour
     Third Upgrade – Dol Amroth troops can be recruited for 50% of their original price

  This would be far to strong (if I understood the ability correctly ). After the third upgrade you can recruit elit Units with heavy arnor and forged blades for 250?
  I would Change the Bonus to
  first upgrade: Dol Amroth troops are recruited at Level two
  second upgrade: Dol Amroth troops are recruited 20% (or more) faster
  third upgrade:Dol Amroth troops can be recruited for 50% of their original Price
  
  For a level five ability this should be strong enought, I think.
  
  But I like the rest of the Concept
  
  best regardes
  Seleukos I.
• #11 von Tiberius Ogden am 28 Feb, 2019 01:01
• You have my dafür for simple reason - I don't use him, I really don't know what to do with him and what he is supposed to be or what his abilities are about.
  Maybe it's because that outpost fortress isn't so interesting like Mirkwood or Dol Guldur etc.
  But it's just another reason why in Dol Amroth should be really interesting hero, worthy of building that fortress.
• #12 von OakenShield224 am 28 Feb, 2019 12:14
• Thanks for the support Tiberius! I think Imrahil is a weak hero in general, but also a symptom of the issue with the fiefdoms (which I've heard has been fixed for 4.5). As for the fortress, I wouldn't really say that it's the worst fortress in game (mainly because Dol Amroth soldiers are pretty good) but I wouldn't really say it is the best and part of that is due to Imrahil.
• #13 von SP19XX am 28 Feb, 2019 13:22
• I think the issue also stems from it being one of the more costly Outpost structures (beaten only by Minas Morgul / Dol Guldur) and tied with Ered Mithrin that is then reliant on a second structure for his full potential that is reliant on time and free command points. While the Dol Amroth Swordsmen are strong, they lack the formation that grante Gondor it's tankiness and their buff can be negligible, especially if we now consider in 4.5 that the Formations of Gondor can cover this gap of it's own accord, and the range of units Imrahil supports is very low indeed.
  
  The Knights of Dol Amroth then are powerhouses as heroic cavalry, but require a minimum investment of 3500 before they can even hit the field and are locked behind a low-mid tier supporting hero at best.
• #14 von Only True Witchking am 28 Feb, 2019 14:16
• I'm also in favour of this suggestion. I always liked Imrahil as a character, and he deserves to be more useful.