I’ve mainly been avoiding this thread and the Grimbeorn thread for a while, but I feel like I should respond to the discussions since I do have a lot to say on the topic. I’ll talk about both here since the proposals are linked. Overall, while I like some ideas of the proposals, I don’t really agree with them. I’ll go through the in-depth reasons why.
Thranduil first. From what I can tell, the proposal is trying to make him into more of a mass slayer but mainly a unit supporter. I don’t really see how the proposal is making him a mass slayer though beyond giving him a temporary AOE effect (even though he already has a permanent AOE effect). I like the idea of Royal Counterattack since it does differentiate from Aragorn’s skill, but I’m not sure it counts as a mass slaying skill (it is basically a summon after all). I’m not really convinced by the supportive changes either to be honest. The current armour leadership has been removed and the attack bonus has been moved onto his level 10 (although buffed). He’s also had a small experience boost and a passive boost against elites/monsters etc. It seems a bit of a nerf from what his current supporting aspect is, and also a bit unnecessary (does Lorien really need ways of dealing with monsters and elites when they have the best archers in the game as well as very good pikes?). In addition, the current leadership suits Thranduil’s character a lot better. In the lore, he and his kingdom were always reclusive, acting defensively to protect their borders from spiders and orcs. It was only in times of need that Thranduil sent his armies to attack (e.g. at the Battle of Five Armies and the Battle of Dol Guldur). In the Hobbit book, even though he wanted his share of the treasure, he was reluctant to start a full war for gold, only going to battle when Dain’s armies arrived. I feel that the unit supportive aspect of this proposal is too aggressive to fit with Thranduil’s character and mindset. In addition, I’m not sure that he’d go on to lead the other units of the faction, considering how isolationist he was. While I did like the Arcane Shield, I don’t really mind it being replaced if the replacement is good (which I believe the Gift is now after a bit of convincing). As for the animations issue, if a good enough set can be found which portrays his grace in battle well, then I’d support that change.
Grimbeorn now. I’ll go through each of his abilities individually to say what I think about them. The only change I can see for the form switch is the removal of the extra building damage when in human form which is a little bit of a nerf but not too bad, I suppose. Ferocious Strike has had the “heavy damage” removed which again seems like a bit of a nerf. I like the Deadly Jump (even if it does just seem like another Gimli leap of which there are 3 in the mod currently). Survival Instinct is the same as currently so that’s fine. With Beorn’s Bees, you’ve said that they’d damage enemies when he’s under attack. That seems sort of redundant to me since, if you’re in the situation where you’d use that ability, he’d already be the in the thick of battle and therefore be getting attacked anyway. As for Power of the Wilderness, the main changes I can see are that the +100% damage has been replaced by being immune to lances and gaining extra armour, which is a decent trade.
Overall, while I’m not really opposed to any of the changes (other than Thranduil going from a defensive hero to an offensive hero via his support abilities), they mostly seem unnecessary for me to be honest. Current Thranduil is one of the heroes I pretty much always get in Lorien matches (along with Galadriel and Haldir) for how useful he is in game, and this proposal doesn’t really seem needed if that makes sense, at least compared to other aspects of the mod. As for Grimbeorn, I’ll admit that I don’t really use him that much in games, but I’m not really sure that this proposal would change how I use him that much. It just seems like a minor nerf.