[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Lothlorien Suggestions
Thranduil
Tiberius Ogden:
--- Zitat von: Julio229 am 22. Jan 2019, 13:52 ---I really like this Thranduil rework.
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Thanks for feedback! I've already implemented quite a lot of your thoughts in the edited comment of mine above! xD
I am still editing something ... Professional deformation :P ...
--- Zitat von: Halbarad am 22. Jan 2019, 11:22 ---Maybe it would suit more if Galadriels Gifts would make the party much bigger, because she gives better wine and Lorien elves come to join the party. But armor is okay too.
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Nice one! I've already thought about it.
Exactly, armor is fine, but ...
--- Zitat ---* Orophin and Rumil: Elven armor that drastically increases their defenses.
* Haldir: Blessed Arrow with more damage and a larger radius than Radiant Arrow
* Celeborn: Lordly armor that increases defences and damage
* Thranduil: Royal armor and an additional row of Palace Guards for his shield wall
* Legolas: Bow of the Galadhrim that increases damage of Hawk Strike and Arrow Wind
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https://modding-union.com/index.php/topic,35589.0.html
... not so unique, many heroes can receive armour ... it seems like Galadriel is walking armory. Armour for her people fits ... but for Thranduil? It looks like Thranduil doesn't have money for buying royal armour ... poor forest guy ... :P
Also your idea how to improve feast isn't bad, but we have to take into account that gifts of Lorien should be directly linked to hero.
So ...
https://modding-union.com/index.php/topic,31332.msg472764.html#msg472764
So Thranduil would receive his armour normally on level five - together with ability "Protector of Woodland realm" which will be probably passive ...
Only True Witchking:
I will excuse all linguistic mistakes with my german keyboard and with the fact that I'm from Germany. ;)
I have to say, I am quite happy about the plans to rework Thranduil, because I very much dislike his current skillset.
I personally of course, would much rather look to the books than to the films, but since Edain in general is getting continously closer to the movies, while straing from the books, I believe that Thranduil is one of the characters who should stay the most with the movies.
He is portrayed in a very cool way I think, and is my favourite character from BOTFA - though that's not saying much.
Visually, he of course is almost perfect, and his character is at least believable for the most part.
What I'm not a fan of, is the skillset that is currently proposed, mainly because of two abilities:
--- Zitat von: Tiberius Ogden am 22. Jan 2019, 13:09 ---Wrath of Elvenking - Thranduil fought many times with the great beasts from the North. Temporarily gains +75% attack bonus against Monsters, heroic and elite units, can't be knocked down and attacks much faster for short period of time.
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Even when ignoring the lore aspect of the first sentence, I don't think this ability is fitting for a mass-slayer. Especially monsters, but also heroic and elite units normally don't appear in great numbers.
Furthermore, Mirkwood and Lorien can already very easily deal with single entities: They have a lot of very good archers, and of course they also have Legolas. And Legolas, eventhough his "Hawkstrike" ability went from 'OP' to 'useless', is still very efficient against not only heroes, but specificially monsters.
So in my personal opinion, "Wrath of the Elvenking" should rather give a bonus similar to this: Thranduil attacks faster and has splash damage for a short period of time.
Also, since I am already talking about Legolas, we shouldn't forget that the prince of Mirkwood already has mass-slayer capabilities due to his insane firing speed and his lvl 10 ability.
The second Thranduil ability I don't like very much is the moving shield wall, I'd still keep the stationary one in some form or another (or just get rid of it completely, and replace it with something else, like an attack order; in the extended movie he's commanding the volleys of arrows against the dwarves and later the orcs: "Leithio!").
Also, his shield wall and leadership seem a bit weak, but then again, it's Edain 4.
I know why I still have the hero submod for 3.8.1 on my laptop. 8-)
But it's good that someone has a plan how to get rid of the chewing gum bubble.
Signed,
The Lord of The Dead City.
Walküre:
It seems that the topic is quite spiralling. Not out of control, though, but rather in the right direction :)
Note aside, it also appears to be the day of valorous Elven lords. From one lord to the other. May it be the time when mistakes will be corrected and flaws fixed.
Concerning the major overhaul, I pretty much agree with everything Tiberius and Julio have said on the matter. The issue does lie in his current (mal-appointed) role. It's clear that it doesn't fit him so well. The idea of correcting it therefore sounds very good. In addition, I see the point regarding Palace Guards: if we want them to be really elite, in the very sense of the word, they should necessarily be gone from the regular outpost and instead be made a special feature of the Woodland King. This makes so much sense, now. Those guards have the supreme, imperative task of caring about the monarch's own well-being. Spawning them as if there were no tomorrow negates their particular nature.
Besides, models of those lancers already exist, if I remember correctly. Ready to be used.
--- Zitat von: Tiberius Ogden am 22. Jan 2019, 14:10 ---So Thranduil would receive his armour normally on level five - together with ability "Protector of Woodland realm" which will be probably passive ...
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I'm fine with a passive ability that grants him his renowned silver armour. I think the current mechanics are one of those inconsistencies that the next patch should (must) do without, like Narya in the hands of Círdan, and so on. Also, I remember your old comment on ModDB: you're right, the Lady is not a walking armoury :D
I'm certain that the general concept will be polished for the better, until it's properly finalised. However, I believe we have another problematic to tackle, and I have anticipated it in my previous reply. What about his controversial animation?
He sports the same animation of Éowyn, if I'm not wrong, which slows his movements down and hampers his attack. We've already concurred that his noble profile corresponds to that of a deadly hero. Hence, given the radical change of skills and role, shouldn't we also seize the opportunity and find another suitable animation? I know that his stance system does not permit him to choose from a wide variety of possibilities, but I'm sure it's worth the try. Without proper movements, any big proposal is more or less halved in effectiveness.
Tiberius Ogden:
--- Zitat von: TheOnlyTrueWitchking am 22. Jan 2019, 16:26 ---"Wrath of the Elvenking" should rather give a bonus similar to this: Thranduil attacks faster and has splash damage for a short period of time.
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I was thinking about splash damage, but then I realized that he deals splash damage through the aggresive stance:
--- Zitat ---Double Sword Stance (aggressive stance) - Thrandul wields two swords and deals slight area damage. Enemies are attacked when sighted.
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But with the Wrath of Elvenking Thranduil can affect larger area, why not. Ok, I'll edit my post. I'll keep "monster issue" fow now, because probably that skill will be on level 7. We will see.
--- Zitat von: TheOnlyTrueWitchking am 22. Jan 2019, 16:26 --- moving shield wall, I'd still keep the stationary one in some form or another (or just get rid of it completely, and replace it with something else, like an attack order; in the extended movie he's commanding the volleys of arrows against the dwarves and later the orcs: "Leithio!").
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I don't want to him command archers, it's up to Legolas who can train them. Summon of special unit quite fits to him, but I'm still thinking how to make last ability stronger and keep mass slayer - unit supporter aspects ... 8-|
--- Zitat von: TheOnlyTrueWitchking am 22. Jan 2019, 16:26 ---Also, his shield wall and leadership seem a bit weak, but then again, it's Edain 4.
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I am quite careful. He costs 2 400 (so not 3 000 like faction leaders) and he is outpost hero. But I'll see.
--- Zitat von: TheOnlyTrueWitchking am 22. Jan 2019, 16:26 ---But it's good that someone has a plan how to get rid of the chewing gum bubble.
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You got us! xD ...
--- Zitat von: Walküre am 22. Jan 2019, 17:18 ---Besides, models of those lancers already exist, if I remember correctly. Ready to be used.
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So what are we talking about? :P
--- Zitat von: Walküre am 22. Jan 2019, 17:18 ---He sports the same animation of Éowyn, if I'm not wrong, which slows his movements down and hampers his attack. We've already concurred that his noble profile corresponds to that of a deadly hero. Hence, given the radical change of skills and role, shouldn't we also seize the opportunity and find another suitable animation? I know that his stance system does not permit him to choose from a wide variety of possibilities, but I'm sure it's worth the try.
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I completely agree. Some animation worthy of agile elf and badass warrior, opposite to slow king. 8-|
The_Necromancer0:
This is the rework I did not know I needed until it was posted. I've always found Thranduil fine but this rework is brilliant. The bubble has always bothered me too, however, I quite like the current effect of Galadriel's gift as I see it being more unique then a simple damage buff. But, it is true that it does not make much sense lorewise, why would a gift from galadriel suddenly push Thranduil to don his armor and command additional troops.
Now, this is a bit pulled by the hairs but here I go, we know Galadriel is a quite a powerful enchantress right? What if Thranduil was now recruited in his armor straight from the start and casting gifts of galadriel on him would grant him something similar to his old bubble shield, some form of increased armor but more subtle. In addition, it would make sense for a gift from Galadriel affecting a troop summoning ability to add Lorien troops to the mix. Lorien isn't exactly known for its tanky/beefy units but perhaps they could be reinforced with galadhrim in the inner circle, more apt to tear down foes to get through the pike wall.
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