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Autor Thema: Erestor and Imladris leveling  (Gelesen 2065 mal)

kmogon

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Erestor and Imladris leveling
« am: 2. Apr 2020, 12:08 »
  Hellow fellow Edainders !  
I come here with yet another thing I would like to discuss yet another aspect of the game which might be seemed by some as a problem - Imladris buildings leveling system. Right now it works as follows: Once library is build all other imladris buildings gain level up ( they are on lvl 2 ). Then , after player researches first row of studies in the library , all buildings level up again ( they are on 3 lvl). At the end when player researches second row of studies in the library , Erestor is being unlocked.

When the concept of tieing structures level to a library is interesting one , it brings some problems.
First of all Imladris, thanks to this system, has the least engaging building upgrade system from all factions. It takes away the possibility for a player to decide between upgrading economy buildings or military ones. Moreover Erestor, our beloved hero , the grand master of all things , is mostly unused due to being locked behind extreme tech cost.
 
So then I come up with some ideas on how the above mentioned dilema could be solved:

- Erestor is available from the start. Player can assign Erestor to any military building or library pernamently and he will stay there till he is assigned to other building. While he is assigned to the building , that building is slowly filling its experiece bar and eventually leveling up. Additionally Erestor boost slightly production of that building and two others nearby. Erestor has a cooldown.

Here we have the first concept which increases the importance of Erestor in the faction and forces the player to decide between leveling your military buildings or his economy. And here I want to add that Library would also be slightly changed. It would aquire experience form Erestor , just like other buildings , but player will be able to speed up this process by researching studies inside it. If player reasearches all studies from one row, he still won't be able to level up the Library , but he will be fairly close it , so there would be need for just a quick use of Erestor there.


The second ide is more concerned around just Erestor as economy upgrades would be rather untouched here:

- Erestor can be used form the start. Apart from slight production boost, he allows the player to buy special units and upgrades from targeted buildng. He stays in choosen building as long as he isn't command to go to another one.

Basically in this concept I have splited building levels and things that they can unlock. While you can increase level of all buildings through studies in the library , it will only increase production speed and health. There you need Erestor for unlocking and buying some more advanced units and upgrades. For example putting Erestor in the barracks allows you to buy archers or research banner carriers.


That are my ideas and I'm more than willing to hear feedback from you as well as some ideas on how you think Imladris economy works now and if Erestor could be made more accessible.

Smeargollum

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Re: Erestor and Imladris leveling
« Antwort #1 am: 2. Apr 2020, 17:59 »
Hello Kmogon!
It is an interesting concept which would improve the situation in my opinion. Right now the system is on the one hand not very balanced and on the other hand not really interesting to play.
His effects on the barracks sound really nice nice to me; I like it. But I am not sure about the resource buildings: It think it is nice for the inside eco because you can start to upgrade them to level 2 quite early and for level 3 you will need some time again but I think that will be fine and interesting to play.
But how is it when the building gets destroyed? Because I don’t think it is possible to rebuild it on the same level as before with that mechanic. And if you would have to level them up again baserushes would be extremely powerful.
And what about the outside farms as they can’t level by Erestor? I think you should keep levelling them with the library but maybe not as quickly. Reduce the price of the library to 700 and then you can level you outside eco to level 2 with the upgrades, and later on to level 3. And maybe when all upgrades are researched the library also brings the inside farms on level 3 to prevent baserushes form just being op.
About the second part of the concept: I would really like it when you can get better tech units while he is in that building; for example blademasters against Mordor spam or something similar.
All over I think that this concept is great even so Erestor might be working a bit overtime then :D

Best regards
Smeargollum


"What if the real balance was the friends we made along the way?"

kmogon

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Re: Erestor and Imladris leveling
« Antwort #2 am: 2. Apr 2020, 18:47 »
Hello Smeargollum , nice to see that you like the concept.
His effects on the barracks sound really nice nice to me; I like it. But I am not sure about the resource buildings: It think it is nice for the inside eco because you can start to upgrade them to level 2 quite early and for level 3 you will need some time again but I think that will be fine and interesting to play.
...
And what about the outside farms as they can’t level by Erestor? I think you should keep levelling them with the library but maybe not as quickly. Reduce the price of the library to 700 and then you can level you outside eco to level 2 with the upgrades, and later on to level 3. And maybe when all upgrades are researched the library also brings the inside farms on level 3 to prevent baserushes form just being op.

I will clarify that Erestor form the rist concept only works on military buildings (barracks, stables, workshop) and library. All resource buildings would be leveling up with library . For this to happen you have to use Erestor on the library to generate experience , but you can help with it by researching studies which would also increase library experience ( not by so much that it can be leveled up without Erestor ). That's because I still one to force player to choose between focusing only on military and level barracks , or try to get eco upgrades sooner. Also I want to increase the importance of building placement by giving Erestor ability to slightly boost production of nearby buildings. So to sum up eco buildings still level up in old fashioned way but they also need a bit of Erestor in it.


But how is it when the building gets destroyed? Because I don’t think it is possible to rebuild it on the same level as before with that mechanic. And if you would have to level them up again baserushes would be extremely powerful.

Here the idea is that once on military building gain level it is permament for all buildings of that type. So for example if the player level up his barracks , all barracks build on the map as well as all future barracks are on level 2 from now on. If I recall correctly there is not yet such mechanic in the edain which allows to upgrade all military buildings of one kind ( for example only all barracks , only all stables ect. at once ).

However if that is impossible to implement then I think that other good solution would be :
1. Erestor gives good armor buff to a building for which he is inside
2. Erestor allows builing to shoot arrows as long as he is inside
3. The building with Erestor inside, is surounded by some soldiers , which will defend it when enemy will come close ( basicaly the same mechanic as with new draft spell of rohan where some soldiers are patrolling around the building )


Smeargollum

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Re: Erestor and Imladris leveling
« Antwort #3 am: 2. Apr 2020, 18:58 »
Zitat
I will clarify that Erestor form the rist concept only works on military buildings (barracks, stables, workshop) and library. All resource buildings would be leveling up with library .
Oh, than I understood that wrong  :o
Ok, like this I like the concept even more :D
The only thing I would not like that much are the other solution for Erestor if the wished one is not possibel because I don't think it is either very usefull nor very logic that he gives the buildings better deffence. I think it would be better if you just need Erestor in the building to be able to recrute higher tech units like archers or blademasters. So he would be much more unique and usefull.

I hope I got the concept this time  [uglybunti]
Regards Smeargollum


"What if the real balance was the friends we made along the way?"

turin.turambar

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Re: Erestor and Imladris leveling
« Antwort #4 am: 2. Apr 2020, 22:13 »
The idea sounds extremely nice to me.

Just some food forthought / potential for going on slightly different (though very much common) routes from this proposal :

Erestor is now available from start, and as long as he is in a building, that building is considered to be one level higher. If the building is already level 3, instead, it gives discount for units recruitments.

I wouldn't be for having erestor going outside of imladris castle, as that wouldn't feel right given his role, so defense added would be rarely used imo. In this proposal, leveling up (for all building) would still occur as now, maybe with erestor needed in library to upgrade all the buildings.

As you see, I'd keep a lot of things from the proposal, but that would allow for more dynamic imladris game, and potentially interesting new strategies., though I'm not too sure about it (I'd guess he'd still be used quite a bit in all the others imladris buildings)

Anyway quite sold to the idea.