[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Discussion and Feedback

Angmar Spellbook

<< < (2/6) > >>

Shagrat:
Reshef, that should be interresting

and
--- Zitat von: Reshef am 23. Apr 2010, 14:32 ---Angmar have in the next version a few new spells in the spellbook.
So I mean that is not important to discuss about the actually.

--- Ende Zitat ---

we normal mortal users hasn't know that until now, if you can remember ;) (no insult)

TheMostBurning:

--- Zitat von: Shagrat am 23. Apr 2010, 14:18 ---Imbalanced, completely imbalanced. That's my opinion, the prod buildings are leveling really slow, with such a Spell you could catapult your opponent from Mid/Late-Game back into Early/Mid-Game


And "War Chant" is a spell. now, i think its more usefull to power up your troops than make your opponents troops weak.


(sorry for my english;))

--- Ende Zitat ---

Hm,i take your point.However,there are  so many others overpowered things,that balancing means 1)improving various underpowered stuff 2)Nerfing various overpowered stuff.
In edain,one building grants as it levels up 10/15/20 resources.So,losing a lvl 3 building and building a lvl1,doesn't mean to come back to early game.A player can expand much faster than the opponent can be able to hurt so much his economy,but the blight would be a power to avoid the enemy builds a too stronger economy than yours.Anyway,a RB needs something like 5 minutes to reach lvl 2,and if blights has a recharge time of 3 minutes,it isn't so imblanced.
The point is,that considering the evil factions,goblin has generally cheaper stuff,while mordor and isengard have overpowered lumber mills(a lvl 3 lumber not boosted gives 40 resouces per laborer,or 60,i don't remeber exactly) and isen is ridicolously strong at gaining resources,angmar instead has a poor economy,and his units aren't cheap.If you can't be strong,make your enemy weaker.
This applies to the debuff i suggested,i thought to that because 1)angmar has really a few debuffs,compared to mordor for example 2)the goal of edain is to diversify the factions,so 4 war chant aren't that nice 3)i think you are wrong when you say that a buff is better than a debuff,as generally the debuffs are stronger than leadership or buffs.
Normally a debuff cancels leadership and gives a -25% damage/armor malus,this obviously mean that a army supported with a debuff results generally stronger than the other.The debuff i suggest instead,doesn't cancel ledership,as it's rare to see a leadership in early game(starting with 1000,and i mean the first 5 minutes of game),but it cancels buffs.
Now,im sorry but i must correct you,as if you search for it,you will find that war chant is a buff.The only spells in the game are darkness and the support powers that heroes have(like glorfindel's starlight).Being able to cancel a buff and weaken the enemy,i must admit however,would be overpowered,so only cancelling buufs would be enough.Just an idea.

About the fact that speaking about the spellbook is useless,apart that as shagrat said we didn't know that in 3.5 there are going to be new powers for angmar,after the 3.5 there will still be a 3.6,so it's not that useless to express ideas.

TheMostBurning:
Ok,5 months passed since i proposed the new angmar spellbook.However now the new one came out,and i have new ideas.Here is my post from Mod DB.



Angmar Spellbook

Blight is a senseless power since 2.01.In 2.02 it has a really great effect,and it's a 25pp.The units in the area get poisoned and the ones posoned in the first 30 seconds become wights after death.This is surely a great power,however i have an other idea.
2 months ago i proposed to make blight reducing 100% rate of production of enemy buildings,to weaken the opponent's economy,rendering the level 3 RB and the industry power useless.But now i think it's not what i wish for angmar.
I propose to make blight a 15 pp power,tier 3,replacing Bande der Gruft(that should definitely be a tier 2 power,as more powerful heroes than karsh only need a tier 2 power,if it shouldn't even be deleted).
It would be a passive power,lowering the production rate of ALL opponent's RB by 25%.It allows angmar to face more powerful economies like mordor's or isengard's,while not changing its own at all.
For the tier 1 place left by blight i would put Terror of Angmar,a 5pp that cancels all enemy modifiers and debuff enemy units in a selected area(slightly bigger than warchant's one).
I think that the Werewolf power should be improved,meaning that also wolfriders should receive spiked collars,not only dire wolves,so people will be more encouraged to use a wolf start strategy.
Tier 3.Well,I already said that i want blight for tier 3,however here is where i sincerely think the team did the worst work.
First,i strongly recommend to add to the freezing rain's modifier a debuff,as it just isn't isn't as good as darkness only with a nullifier.
Ice Dragon.Ah,what can I say.I hated it first time i saw it replaced giants,but i was sure that after 2 version it was gonna be changed.And instead?No,ID is still there.Guys,i seriously can't even conceive how you could create a so stupid power.I mean,it just sucks.It is intended to freeze enemy units and slowdown them,but it's(completely)bugged.You didn't improve the 2.01 dragon locomotor at all,and we know it's bugged in a ridicolous way.Then,most times it freezes nothing,the only way you can be sure to freeze something is with the ice breath.Unfortunately,that works badly as well.In addition of this,the dragon is simply weak.I never take it in a game,as i know freezing rain is a tenh times better choice to reach avalanche.
Here is my suggestion:replace Ice Dragon with a power that has the same purpose,but that will work much better.Frost Core(it's just a name,it can be changed :b).It's just like Soul Freeze,but lasts 30 seconds and has a radius of 300.I think that it will be much more useful than the ice dragon,it's like a Snow Blind for units.
Lastly avalanche should be tweaked(how much siege damage per chunk,450?)as i alway kill all buildings of the enemy plus the fort with it,meaning that with this power i can win the game in one hit.Once i was on a 1v1 and i won this way!
About Udun tor...most people say that it's strenght is in the summon.But as udun tor is as slow as balrog when summoning,it's purpose can't be that.The strenght of the watcher is precisely in the summon,as it is fast and it deals 1000 crush damage.The balrog compensates the speed of his summon with an amazing power,but udun tor does not.Udun tor isn't good at killing armies,as summoned unit just die easily,even being unable to select appropriate targets,and it sucks at killing bases.Now i would think you made a power weak and when you noticed it you improved avalanche to compensate.I call this IMBA.But i want to believe you didn't want this.Then,why don't you finally improve the summons?I have a idea for Udun Tor really,but i think that it could be a good power even if it remains as you made it,if well done.My idea is to realize udun tor as a black icy vortex with radius 300,lasting 15 seconds and dealing 200 magic damge and 50 frost damage per second,it perfectly fits with the tolkien's lore i think.


I definitely think Bande der gruft is a useless power.Heroes like King Elessar,Gandalf the White and Saruman of many colours are much more useful than karsh.They are all the strongest heroes of their factions,while karsh it's not.A 14pp just isn't worth to have him permanently.The secod effect of reviving wights is useless as well.No one creates wights armies,and the wights created by wells of souls are level 1,so they aren't affected by the power.

Shagrat:

--- Zitat von: TheMostBurning am 16. Sep 2010, 14:11 ---Ok,5 months passed since i proposed the new angmar spellbook.However now the new one came out,and i have new ideas.Here is my post from Mod DB.



Angmar Spellbook

Blight is a senseless power since 2.01.In 2.02 it has a really great effect,and it's a 25pp.The units in the area get poisoned and the ones posoned in the first 30 seconds become wights after death.This is surely a great power,however i have an other idea.
2 months ago i proposed to make blight reducing 100% rate of production of enemy buildings,to weaken the opponent's economy,rendering the level 3 RB and the industry power useless.But now i think it's not what i wish for angmar.
I propose to make blight a 15 pp power,tier 3,replacing Bande der Gruft(that should definitely be a tier 2 power,as more powerful heroes than karsh only need a tier 2 power,if it shouldn't even be deleted).
It would be a passive power,lowering the production rate of ALL opponent's RB by 25%.It allows angmar to face more powerful economies like mordor's or isengard's,while not changing its own at all.
For the tier 1 place left by blight i would put Terror of Angmar,a 5pp that cancels all enemy modifiers and debuff enemy units in a selected area(slightly bigger than warchant's one).
I think that the Werewolf power should be improved,meaning that also wolfriders should receive spiked collars,not only dire wolves,so people will be more encouraged to use a wolf start strategy.
Tier 3.Well,I already said that i want blight for tier 3,however here is where i sincerely think the team did the worst work.
First,i strongly recommend to add to the freezing rain's modifier a debuff,as it just isn't isn't as good as darkness only with a nullifier.
Ice Dragon.Ah,what can I say.I hated it first time i saw it replaced giants,but i was sure that after 2 version it was gonna be changed.And instead?No,ID is still there.Guys,i seriously can't even conceive how you could create a so stupid power.I mean,it just sucks.It is intended to freeze enemy units and slowdown them,but it's(completely)bugged.You didn't improve the 2.01 dragon locomotor at all,and we know it's bugged in a ridicolous way.Then,most times it freezes nothing,the only way you can be sure to freeze something is with the ice breath.Unfortunately,that works badly as well.In addition of this,the dragon is simply weak.I never take it in a game,as i know freezing rain is a tenh times better choice to reach avalanche.
Here is my suggestion:replace Ice Dragon with a power that has the same purpose,but that will work much better.Frost Core(it's just a name,it can be changed :b).It's just like Soul Freeze,but lasts 30 seconds and has a radius of 300.I think that it will be much more useful than the ice dragon,it's like a Snow Blind for units.
Lastly avalanche should be tweaked(how much siege damage per chunk,450?)as i alway kill all buildings of the enemy plus the fort with it,meaning that with this power i can win the game in one hit.Once i was on a 1v1 and i won this way!
About Udun tor...most people say that it's strenght is in the summon.But as udun tor is as slow as balrog when summoning,it's purpose can't be that.The strenght of the watcher is precisely in the summon,as it is fast and it deals 1000 crush damage.The balrog compensates the speed of his summon with an amazing power,but udun tor does not.Udun tor isn't good at killing armies,as summoned unit just die easily,even being unable to select appropriate targets,and it sucks at killing bases.Now i would think you made a power weak and when you noticed it you improved avalanche to compensate.I call this IMBA.But i want to believe you didn't want this.Then,why don't you finally improve the summons?I have a idea for Udun Tor really,but i think that it could be a good power even if it remains as you made it,if well done.My idea is to realize udun tor as a black icy vortex with radius 300,lasting 15 seconds and dealing 200 magic damge and 50 frost damage per second,it perfectly fits with the tolkien's lore i think.

--- Ende Zitat ---

ok. I THINk blight is good as it is, because you can disturb your enemy in early game and even Lategame, this passive Spell is already by the Witch-King, when he got the Ring + the Recuitment of Soldiers of the enemy needs + 20% (?) of normal time

the Bande der Gruft as 15er Spell is good in my opinion, because you can Karsh have instand level 10, so it would be to strong and the Barrow-Wight summon is a realy good spell.

I never had Problems with the Ice Dragon, ok he's to weak, but in my opinion, you just have to make im Stronger (and the Box for mark him bigger^^ as enemy you nearly can't attack him^^)

the Udun-Tor is great how it is,  because it's a tunnel you can sey to Udun (not Utumno or Udun in Mordor) to the Underworld of Middle-Earth, where Creatures are who maybe nobody has ever seen (except from Illuvater and the Valars^^)

The Bande der Gruft is not useless, Karsh is an Hero-Killer and a great unit kiler if you use him right, in the actual Version he can kill Saruman, Gandalf the Whit and even Sauron with Ring with his Stage 8 Ability, i think its gonna be weaker in one of the next Versions, but he is usefull

TheMostBurning:
Blight remains useless.No economy will get hurt by weakening(temporarily)the production rate of only one building.Any player will rebuild a level 1 building affected,so it hasn't any use at all,people just take it as it brings to werewolves.
A level 3 RB affected by Eternal Winter produces 240 resources per minute,Blight would make it produce 225 resources per minute.You could say it's only 15 resources less,but it doesn't need the Witch King nor the one ring.At this point we could say rain of fire is useless as sauron has fires of gorgoroth that are even more useful,but that doesn't make sense :P

Karsh is a pretty good hero,i never negated it,but he isn't as useful as Sauron(altough he could kill him).I think that Bande der gruft should remain,but only as a tier two 8 pp power.

A massive soul of freeze is definitely better than the ice dragon in every way(it can save your army and stop the enemy's one),however the radius should be 200,or it is too strong.

The udun tor is good yes,but only if it would be a tier 3.Summoned units are just too weak and they are hostile to the summoner,i already listed the reasons it is weak for.The effect i propose is just like the cirdan's Maelstrom,but bigger and stronger.

Navigation

[0] Themen-Index

[#] Nächste Seite

[*] Vorherige Sete