[en] The Prancing Pony > The Lord of the Rings
Lore Corner - Questions and Debates
VectorMaximus:
The effects the One Ring has is directly proportional to how much magical ability (or how mighty) someone was to begin with. So for people such as Isildur, Bilbo, and Frodo, it only grants invisibility, having no magical power of their own. On the other hand, the One, when wielded (or theoretically wielded) by mighty beings such as Galadriel, Gandalf, Elrond, Saruman, or Sauron, has a multiplying effect on their power.
However, its never said whether its said if he wanted it to provide invisibility. However, this One Ring, the Master Ring, was meant to be the greatest of them all (obviously that failed; the One does not have the same powers as say the 3, for example). And some of the lesser 'trial' rings granted invisibility. So I would not be surprised at all if it had Invisibility built into it from the beginning.
As for what purpose the invisibility could serve? Sauron, mastermind though he is, has a track record of actually losing his confrontations when on the battlefield himself. He is master tactician, administrator and manipulator, not a warrior. So if invisibility was built into the ring back when he could be fair, it could also serve as a way of him escaping defeat.
Hamanathnath:
--- Zitat von: VectorMaximus am 7. Mär 2016, 17:15 ---The effects the One Ring has is directly proportional to how much magical ability (or how mighty) someone was to begin with. So for people such as Isildur, Bilbo, and Frodo, it only grants invisibility, having no magical power of their own. On the other hand, the One, when wielded (or theoretically wielded) by mighty beings such as Galadriel, Gandalf, Elrond, Saruman, or Sauron, has a multiplying effect on their power.
However, its never said whether its said if he wanted it to provide invisibility. However, this One Ring, the Master Ring, was meant to be the greatest of them all (obviously that failed; the One does not have the same powers as say the 3, for example). And some of the lesser 'trial' rings granted invisibility. So I would not be surprised at all if it had Invisibility built into it from the beginning.
As for what purpose the invisibility could serve? Sauron, mastermind though he is, has a track record of actually losing his confrontations when on the battlefield himself. He is master tactician, administrator and manipulator, not a warrior. So if invisibility was built into the ring back when he could be fair, it could also serve as a way of him escaping defeat.
--- Ende Zitat ---
Interesting. Still, I don't think Sauron would intentionally want the One Ring to give invincibility. Even though he is not a great warrior, I think the power he would get from the One Ring would make him strong enough to win against pretty much anyone. I would imagine there would be a very small amount of people that could defeat Sauron once he has the One Ring(or, at least, that is what he would think before Isildur defeated him).
And Sauron doesn't seem to be very cautious. I would argue that if he was more cautious, he would not have lost the ring in the first place, so I don't think he would even want a function that allows him to escape combat.
Of course, you know much more then me when it comes to this lore, so correct me if I'm wrong with anything I say. ;)
VectorMaximus:
Sauron loses the Ring because he gets cocky off his victory over the 2 High-Kings, personally. He's not expecting Isildur or anyone being able to defeat him at this point. That's why he goes to 'humiliate' his enemies in killing Isildur by choking, to serve as an example of his power. However, I personally believe that even if Isildur failed to get the ring off him, he still would have lost to the Alliance.
And also, the Ring's ability to grant invisibility could also be used for manipulative reasons (this of course, back when he was still fair). He could walk among his enemies and whisper in their ears, spread doubt and suspicion, his enemies believing his voice is their own worries.
Hamanathnath:
--- Zitat von: VectorMaximus am 7. Mär 2016, 17:55 ---Sauron loses the Ring because he gets cocky off his victory over the 2 High-Kings, personally. He's not expecting Isildur or anyone being able to defeat him at this point. That's why he goes to 'humiliate' his enemies in killing Isildur by choking, to serve as an example of his power. However, I personally believe that even if Isildur failed to get the ring off him, he still would have lost to the Alliance.
And also, the Ring's ability to grant invisibility could also be used for manipulative reasons (this of course, back when he was still fair). He could walk among his enemies and whisper in their ears, spread doubt and suspicion, his enemies believing his voice is their own worries.
--- Ende Zitat ---
Yeah I guess that makes more sense. I guess there is no definite answer, but I would be willing to believe that he would use it to spread doubt, or potentially spy on them.
That is actually a question I've had for a while. I really appreciate you answering it. :)
Adamin:
--- Zitat von: Hamanathnath am 7. Mär 2016, 15:08 ---So my question is not why does it make you invisible, but actually, Did Sauron want the One Ring to do that? If so, why? What purpose does that serve?
--- Ende Zitat ---
Good question.
Yes, the Ring brings you into the Unseen World, the Wraith World, and thus turns you invisible for everyone who only dwells in the Seen World.
But why he does that is something, I don't think I ever heard of. ^^
I think Galadriel mentions, that someone who could use the ring, wouldn't turn invisible. So like VectorMaximus mentioned, only People without a strong Will or magical powers will turn invisible "by default".
(though I would actually say Isildurs Will might have been strong enough. Same goes for Aragorn btw.)
So my speculation would be that the invisibility part was just another unplanned side effect of the ring, that Sauron never expected that or used it in that way.
As you said Hamanathnath, I also think it doesn't make sense for Sauron, who could have controlled and beaten enemies with the ring, to use it for hidden attacks or stealth missions.
After all, we know of Saurons greatest manipulative Mission: The Seduction of Numenor. And he did it definetly WITHOUT the One Ring.
So why does the One Ring Transport you into the Unseen World? What is the Unseen World anyway?
No idea.
Maybe it is a world where Spirits are much easier to access? Since the One Ring gives you the power to dominate minds, maybe he's channeling your power into the Unseen in order to dominate other Spirits from there?
Maybe. Who knows... ^^
--- Zitat --- So if invisibility was built into the ring back when he could be fair, it could also serve as a way of him escaping defeat.
--- Ende Zitat ---
Back when he was fair, means also back when he could take any form he wanted. Why should he Need to turn invisible then in order to flee, when he just as well Change his form into something unnoticeable, or maybe completely leave his Body behind?
(though I'm not 100 % sure if Sauron could have leaft his Body...)
--- Zitat ---Sauron loses the Ring because he gets cocky off his victory over the 2 High-Kings, personally. He's not expecting Isildur or anyone being able to defeat him at this point. That's why he goes to 'humiliate' his enemies in killing Isildur by choking, to serve as an example of his power.
--- Ende Zitat ---
Nope.
Just in the movie version.
In the book Sauron lost in an epic brawl against Gil-Galad AND Elendil AND Elrond AND Cirdan AND Isildur, all at once. Sauron was already lying defeated on the ground (after killing Gil-Galad and Elendil) when Isildur stepped up and cut the One Ring off his finger.
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