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Umfrage

Should Iron Hills or Ered Luin get new and unique Outpost!?

Iron Hills should get the new Assembly Halls!
35 (58.3%)
Ered Luin should get the new Assembly Halls!
8 (13.3%)
No they should remain as they are with Lake-Town!
17 (28.3%)

Stimmen insgesamt: 54

Autor Thema: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills  (Gelesen 109929 mal)

Fredius

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #165 am: 6. Sep 2015, 14:49 »
3. Yes, i think too that Dwarves of Iron Hills should get a new outopost.

From your previous post I thought you were against the outpost, so I had added ypu to the "against" list in the German section. My apologies for that I'll change that now :).

Gnomi

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #166 am: 6. Sep 2015, 15:19 »
One last thing frmo me then I'm out. I'm only writing it here, because you can argue that it has to do with the topic.
Zitat
Gnomi - Main reason that most of players chose Edain, is diversity from original. Diversity containing buildings, units, heroes, spells and many many more. So it's wouldn't be wise to limit them to only this ones who's most useful, as you like.
Have I ever written that I would want to do those limits?
No. :P I know that not everyone has my opinion and therefore I would never suggest such a thing. As I also tried to say, the amount of truops always depends on the game. I also play AoW and every faction has about 20 different units. It fits perfectly for that game and I'm happy for it: But every unit has a purpose and there is a reason why you should be unit A or unit B.

Concerning Edain:
In earlier times (until edain 2.2 or something like that) edain already had really good skins and modells, but it was more of a standard mod. Why? Well, we just added dozens of different units and dozens of abilities. You had about 5-10 troups in every barracks and there was nearly no difference between most of them. Then we started to think more about the units. We put some of those units in spells (and made them not buildable anymore).
The more we changed those things, the more people started to say that edain doesn't feel like a normal mod anymore, but more like a completely new game.
Of course it's important to have new designs and have more things in the game as in the vanilla game - that's one of the things which made edain famous. But edain also got so big, because we started thinking about different ways of integrating units, which helped us to intergate more designs, but still have everything easy to understand, suitable for new users (if you build a barracks and have 20 different units it's more irritating and even when the units are good, it's more difficult to get ued to the mod)
The same counts for
When we did this, suddenly edain got more and more famous and even though the game got older, we got fans much faster than before. :)

So you're right: People like edain for the diversity.
But this diversity exists and is less stressful if there is no overkill and you have the feeling that you know what you're doing and aren't unsure all the time what you should do.^^

So we will continue doing this:
Adding new things, but we won't just add them as normal units to have more units, but will always think about way to integrate them and give them clear and easy understandable duties (and differences to other troups) to help beginners fully understand and enjoy the game. :)

Aragorn II.

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #167 am: 6. Sep 2015, 16:14 »
If I have seemed provocatively, I'm sorry, that was not my intention. English is not my mother tongue, so it is more difficult for me than to write n German.
However, I find it's not fair that some members insulted me personally. I think I have, as everyone has, the right to express my opinion about a concept and can understand that not everyone like my opinion. But for me that is not a justification to call me a troll.
In a discussion you will rarely have the same opinion as the discussion partner. I think you should always respect the other member, even when he/she have another opinion. Because my comments were apparently not understood the way they were intended, but were perceived as provocative, I think it`s better when i go back to the german forum. I hope the matter is resolved and you can continue on your concept discuss

Have a nice day.

Tienety

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #168 am: 7. Sep 2015, 08:39 »
Ok, I made a few changes in the concept.

About Ered Mithrin. Thorin also asked for help for dwaves from the mountains of the North(Ered Mithrin is in north). If dwarves don't live in this area. Why would he do that? 8-|
Hobbit, Chapter 15: THE GATHERING OF THE CLOUDS:
Zitat
Then Thorin burst forth in anger: “Our thanks, Roäc Carc’s son. You and your people shall not be forgotten. But none of our gold shall thieves take or the violent carry off while we are alive. If you would earn our thanks still more, bring us news of any that draw near. Also I would beg of you, if any of you are still young and strong of wing, that you would send messengers to our kin in the mountains of the North, both west from here and east, and tell them of our plight. But go specially to my cousin Dain in the Iron Hills, for he has many people well-armed, and dwells nearest to this place. Bid him hasten!”

Fine

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #169 am: 7. Sep 2015, 10:49 »
I think he was talking about "The North" in general, as in "the northern part of Middle-earth". So he sent messengers to the mountains in the north of the world, not "in a northern direction from here".

Dwarves did live in the Ered Mithrin, I believe they went there after living at Erebor for some time after the fall of Khâzad-dûm. But during the youth of Thrór, grandfather of Thorin, they were driven out by Dragons who killed their king, Thrór's father, and his brother. The dwarves then returned to Erebor as well as settling in the Iron Hills. There have been no reports of Dwarves living in Ered Mithrin since.
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LordDainIronfoot

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #170 am: 7. Sep 2015, 12:25 »
My friend the quote Tienity used is the pure evidence that some small numbers of Dwarves or Colonies stayed in Ered Mithrin! :-)
North part of Middle Earth yoy say mate!?Well Ered Mithrin is in North Middle Earth ,well Iron Hills too but from Erebor point it is in the East! :-) And where else in Northern Middle Earth there were Dwarven Kingdoms except Ered Mithrin!?I doubt there were Dwarves in Carm Dum or Angmar ,the only place left is Gundabad Peak but it belongs to the Orcs from thw Ancient Times! :-) So the only Northern Mountains and North from Erebor where could be Dwarves is Ered Mithrin! :-)
Here is a map my friend
So please show me where other in the the North Middle Earth there can be Dwarves that Thorin refered to!?Except the Ered Mithrin which is in Northern Middle Earth and is North of Erebor itself! :-)
I hope you understand what I mean !
Greetings! :-)
« Letzte Änderung: 7. Sep 2015, 12:33 von LordDainIronfoot »
"I will not stand down before any Elf,not least this Faithless Woodland Sprite,he wishesh nothing but ill upon my people...To Battle,to Battle Sons of Durin!!!..."

"You,think I give a dead dog about your threats you Pointy Ear Princess...Hear now lads,we are on...Let's give those bastards a good Hammering!!!..."

Fine

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #171 am: 7. Sep 2015, 12:38 »
I respect your opinion and the friendly tone of it! :)
But to me it seems that the quote is talking about the mountains of the North of Middle-eart, east and west of Erebor - that would be the Blue Mountains in the west, and the Iron Hills (and possibly the Orocarni) in the east.

if any of you are still young and strong of wing, that you would send messengers to our kin in the mountains of the North, both west from here and east, and tell them of our plight.

It is entirely possible that there were still small holdouts and outposts of the dwarves in the Ered Mithrin, but the quote Tienety provided does not seem to imply that Thorin sent messengers there.
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LordDainIronfoot

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #172 am: 7. Sep 2015, 12:54 »
Thank you for the polite attitude! :-)
And while I agree that the quote has somehow double meaning and can mean two things ! :-) But you have to agree that while it can mean Mountains of the Northern Part on East and West it can also include the Northern Mountains itself which is Ered Mithrin! :-) And I think those few small colonies would be able to send at least 2 battalions as reinforcement in BFME ! :-)
So the point is that the one meaning doesn't exclude the second one amd I think we both agree that there are some small numbers of Dwarves in Ered Mithrin! :-)
« Letzte Änderung: 7. Sep 2015, 13:01 von LordDainIronfoot »
"I will not stand down before any Elf,not least this Faithless Woodland Sprite,he wishesh nothing but ill upon my people...To Battle,to Battle Sons of Durin!!!..."

"You,think I give a dead dog about your threats you Pointy Ear Princess...Hear now lads,we are on...Let's give those bastards a good Hammering!!!..."

Fredius

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #173 am: 7. Sep 2015, 13:46 »
He said both West from here and East. The important part is from here, and North from here lie only the Grey Mountains, not even the Iron Hills because that lies directly to the East. If you take a look at the map, the Grey Mountains are a long range of mountains that reach as far as near Gundabad, so with "both West and East" he most likely meant from the Western point of the Grey Mountains to the Eastern point of the Grey Mountains. Having said that, perhaps the Dwarves were only driven away in the eastern part of the Grey Mountains, but the Western part was still intact? Or they were just spread like little colonies on the mountain range?

Furthermore, this quote might actually prove that the Orocarni Dwarves were contacted as well. "Both west from here and east" he might have meant from the Western point of the Grey Mountains to the East where the Red Mountains are.  This doesn't seem impossible if you ask me ;).

LordDainIronfoot

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #174 am: 7. Sep 2015, 14:31 »
I admit I didn't thought about that as a possibility!! :) But Fredius is absolutely right! :)
There is no 100% specific place pointed as a residence fo the Dwarves in Ered Mithrin which suggests they could have had few Strongholds trough all Ered Mithrin which indeed is quite a long and wide MOuntain Range! :) And even if you think deeper into it what is the point for Thorin to send for Help from Ered Luin,simply put they are too far away to be abel to get there in time ,too long distance so it is pointless! :)
So I agree that the East includes Iron Hills and Orocarni and North being it in West can actually mean West Ered Mithrin after all as I said it is long Mountain Range and it is possible to have still some smal lDwarven Stronghold or even few! :)
Nice argument there Fredius,you really got me this time ;) :D
"I will not stand down before any Elf,not least this Faithless Woodland Sprite,he wishesh nothing but ill upon my people...To Battle,to Battle Sons of Durin!!!..."

"You,think I give a dead dog about your threats you Pointy Ear Princess...Hear now lads,we are on...Let's give those bastards a good Hammering!!!..."

Gandalf The Gray

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #175 am: 7. Sep 2015, 15:01 »
i agree with dain on this one also i think iron heels with lake town it just make no sense
even when they fight together in the movie lake town that now is dale leave the dwarfs and the elfs and they are going to defend dale so it makes more sense to have the elfs as an outpost for iron heels ??? i think not and to put 2 lake towns is kinda not unique i dont know this is just my thinking

Fredius

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #176 am: 7. Sep 2015, 15:09 »
I admit I didn't thought about that as a possibility!! :) But Fredius is absolutely right! :)
There is no 100% specific place pointed as a residence fo the Dwarves in Ered Mithrin which suggests they could have had few Strongholds trough all Ered Mithrin which indeed is quite a long and wide MOuntain Range! :) And even if you think deeper into it what is the point for Thorin to send for Help from Ered Luin,simply put they are too far away to be abel to get there in time ,too long distance so it is pointless! :)
So I agree that the East includes Iron Hills and Orocarni and North being it in West can actually mean West Ered Mithrin after all as I said it is long Mountain Range and it is possible to have still some smal lDwarven Stronghold or even few! :)
Nice argument there Fredius,you really got me this time ;) :D

Heh, well if I knew about this quote before than I certainly would have said it sooner ;).

i agree with dain on this one also i think iron heels with lake town it just make no sense
even when they fight together in the movie lake town that now is dale leave the dwarfs and the elfs and they are going to defend dale so it makes more sense to have the elfs as an outpost for iron heels ??? i think not and to put 2 lake towns is kinda not unique i dont know this is just my thinking

That makes sense, Lake-town had better relations with the Mirkwood Elves than the Iron Hills Dwarves. If Mirkwood was a faction of it's own than it would only be logical to give them Lake-town.

LordDainIronfoot

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #177 am: 7. Sep 2015, 15:13 »
After all said and done here I just really hope that we were able to show the worthiness of the idea and convince our German freinds that it is more lore friendly and proper than Lake Town for Iron Hills! :)
I really hope that they will see the logic and facts and conclude that it is more apropriate for Iron Hills based on all lore facts we shared here! : )
Greetings! :)
« Letzte Änderung: 7. Sep 2015, 15:16 von LordDainIronfoot »
"I will not stand down before any Elf,not least this Faithless Woodland Sprite,he wishesh nothing but ill upon my people...To Battle,to Battle Sons of Durin!!!..."

"You,think I give a dead dog about your threats you Pointy Ear Princess...Hear now lads,we are on...Let's give those bastards a good Hammering!!!..."

Fredius

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #178 am: 7. Sep 2015, 15:28 »
I'll edit the post on the German forums as soon as possible guys. Thanks btw Tienety for the changes in the concepts, but I won't put in the crossbow design because they want as few hobbit concepts as possible (else they might accuse us again :P). And I agree, at this point the lore shouldn't be the reason for not using this concept.

However, are there some other ideas we could use for Grimir? Ealendril himself stated that he doesn't like his design in both appearance and abilities. That's all the information he gave.

LordDainIronfoot

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Re: New and Different Outpost Building for Ered Luin/Iron Hills
« Antwort #179 am: 7. Sep 2015, 16:42 »
I agree Fredeius,there are many possible looks for Crossbow so it wil lbe better as you said to remove it so we won't get accused again! :)
Here are efw None Movie ideas! ;)
And I most of all hope that lore will no longer be the rason to hold the concept back! :)

About Grimir there are endless possibilities since he is not a lore hero!We can make him even from Orocarni and give him all sorts of abilitie as long as te Team finds them good! :)
Here is Concept from my personal favourites which I would have loved to see as Dain,Nain or Durin himself! :) but ti can be used for Orocarni Lord or Ered Mithrin Chief...
And with all my respect ot Ea as Leader of the Team,if he do not like the current Grimir but still likes the idea he simply can suggest a diffrent Hero with different name and Abilities,after all it is an open discussion about the Idea should it be used and how can it be improved! :)

Greetings to all! :)
« Letzte Änderung: 7. Sep 2015, 17:01 von LordDainIronfoot »
"I will not stand down before any Elf,not least this Faithless Woodland Sprite,he wishesh nothing but ill upon my people...To Battle,to Battle Sons of Durin!!!..."

"You,think I give a dead dog about your threats you Pointy Ear Princess...Hear now lads,we are on...Let's give those bastards a good Hammering!!!..."