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Autor Thema: Dwarven Balance Discussion  (Gelesen 68159 mal)

Odysseus

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #75 am: 14. Apr 2016, 18:59 »
Alright, loud and clear.

Narin is a recent addition, so I don't think he is perfectly balanced either at the moment. I suppose he was a little overlooked with all the upheaval each newly released faction is causing.

What do you propose should change about Narin?
“For so sworn good or evil an oath may not be broken and it shall pursue oathkeeper and oathbreaker to the world's end.”

Elite KryPtik

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #76 am: 14. Apr 2016, 19:25 »
Well, I think that maybe a merge of combat command and the passive would be cool, the passive as it is now, but then when activated the passive gets replaced by the current effect of combat command. That way you could have your passive leadership when trampling, and Combat Command when stuck in, but not have them both stack and be OP. Then the Combat Command slot could be replaced with a new ability.
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Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #77 am: 14. Apr 2016, 19:32 »
Even without Narin's support they are stronger than knights because they attack faster if I'm not mistaken. And I agree with Kryptik (for once xD), you can't look at ram riders isolated. Narin will always be around, and his buffs make them pretty much unkillable. I'd be happy with adjusting their performace and cost to put them in line with Rohirrim instead of Knights, making them standard cavalry instead of Elite. Dwarven Infantry is arguably the strongest in the entire game, they don't need crazy good cavalry as well. It doesn't fit them well thematically imho.

Odysseus

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #78 am: 14. Apr 2016, 20:06 »
I agree with this. Making them mostly good for harassing perhaps, or support on the flanks and the rear, but not the front.
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FilipMakedonski

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #79 am: 15. Apr 2016, 13:32 »
I see that many people still argue about the strength of the Ram Riders. I found these unit pretty useful for flanking and straight on charge on enemy non spear units. Yes, they are strong now with the new update, but, their role is scout unit. So, to make the balance a bit challenging and better, could you make them 5 per unit plus the scout leader ?
This way  they will still be powerful, limited to 3 and you will have to use them more wisely and thus keep their stats as they are.

Leri_weill

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #80 am: 15. Apr 2016, 13:36 »
I see that many people still argue about the strength of the Ram Riders. I found these unit pretty useful for flanking and straight on charge on enemy non spear units. Yes, they are strong now with the new update, but, their role is scout unit. So, to make the balance a bit challenging and better, could you make them 5 per unit plus the scout leader ?
This way  they will still be powerful, limited to 3 and you will have to use them more wisely and thus keep their stats as they are.

5 is maybe not enough, I'd say 2*4 per unit (or 2*3 ?), so that they would still be powerfull and therefore usefull, but not too much.

Hamanathnath

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #81 am: 15. Apr 2016, 13:45 »
I don't think that lowering the number of units in a Ram Rider group is needed.  They just shouldn't be able to charge directly into pikes, not take basically any damage from it, and then win in melee combat.  They are just too strong with Narin around, and because you need Narin to even get them, they are always ridiculously powerful. 

Hamanathnath

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #82 am: 3. Mai 2016, 14:49 »
Got some things to talk about concerning Dwarven Balance :)

General:
-Battlewagons are in a great spot right now, so credit to the team for making them a useful unit.  However, I've always thought that there Command Point cost was a bit low, and because of their improved performance it is a bit more noticeable.  I suggest moving it up from 20 CP to 30 CP. 

-Demolishers seem to take a lot more Damage from standard arrows then pretty much any other Battering Ram.  Their armor seems quite low in general, but I realize this is because they can Deploy extra armor.  But I think that the damage from Not Upgraded Arrows with and without the Armor Deployed seems too much, so I suggest making them taking less damage from Standard Arrows in general.

Ered Luin:
-I always have trouble with the Unburnt Charge Attack.  It does good damage against single groups, but in an Army vs Amy situation,the Unburnt usually just charge in, get some kills from the charge, but they get stuck in the middle of the enemy army and mauled to death.  While thi was always a problem with the Charge Attack in my opinion, even when it was on Iron Hills Guardians before the Dwarven Overhaul, there are a number of reasons why it is more of a problem now.

1.  Unburnt can't be purchased that early in a match as Guardians, meaning that by the time you get them, your enemy should have a sizable force.

2.  The problem with the Charge Attack is somewhat nullified when you have a lot of units using it at once.  However, because of the Unburnt's higher Resource cost and Command Point cost, it is a lot harder to get enough of them to do this.

3.  Unburnt, due to their higher cost, are a much more valuable loss then Guardians. 

Now I don't exactly know of a way to completely fix this problem, but I think something that would make it not as bad would be to Increase the Armor of the Unburnt after the Charge Attack is preformed, because if I remember correctly, it only increases damage right now.  I don't think that this is overpowered because Unburnt are elite units, so them having a stronger buff to the Charge Attack would make more sense. 

Erebor:
-Erebor Phalanxes are one of the only units to have a negative effect on their active ability.  If it was a stance, then a negative would make more sense, but becuase it already has a time limit, the negative effect doesn't really need to be their in my opinion.  It is still a useful ability, it just seems rather odd they get a debuff against cavalry in the process. 

-Brand's Falcon is a pretty awful ability for how late you get it.  The Dwarves already have the Raven's for scouting, and requiring a lvl 5 Brand to get a worse scouting ability doesn't make much sense in my eyes.  This ability needs to be improved significantly, or just outright replaced. 

Iron Hills:
-I know that this has been said already, but Murin's level 8 Battle Cry is very underwhelming for how late you get it.  Fear abilities are good, but other heroes with them get them much earlier. Some extra benefits to it would be cool, maybe something like Inspiring Nearby Heroes to deal more damage for a short time. 

-Scouts of the Iron Hills take way to long to train in my opinion.  I understand that the timer was most likely increased because of how fast they run when they are recruited, but I think that this was a bit too much.

That's it for now. :)


Odysseus

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #83 am: 3. Mai 2016, 15:18 »
Pretty much agree to what Haman said. Except the Dwarven Battering Ram though. The thing does bizarre amounts of damage, so I'd rather have it be weaker, even by arrows.

In regards to Bard's and Brand's scouting abilities, I believe they are just an extra bonus. They become more important if you do not get the ravens though.
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Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #84 am: 3. Mai 2016, 15:29 »
Murin's Battlecry already debuffs the armor of nearby enemies by 25% iirc.

Hamanathnath

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #85 am: 3. Mai 2016, 15:49 »
In regards to Bard's and Brand's scouting abilities, I believe they are just an extra bonus. They become more important if you do not get the ravens though.
I sort of understand, but it really is a waste of an ability.  Ravens are easy to get and just outright better because of the debuff. 

Murin's Battlecry already debuffs the armor of nearby enemies by 25% iirc.
Im pretty sure it doesn't.  I don't remember seeing that last time I used Murin, and the Edain Wikia also says it just applies fear.  But I'm totally for something like an Armor debuff.
« Letzte Änderung: 3. Mai 2016, 15:57 von Hamanathnath »

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #86 am: 3. Mai 2016, 16:27 »
Maybe something got lost in translation then. The german description says: "Múrin stößt einen Schlachtruf aus, der feindliche Einheiten für 5 Sekunden lähmt und ihre Verteidigung um -25% reduziert"
-> "Murin utters a battlecry, stunning enemy units for 5 seconds and reducing their defense by -25%"
Admittedly, five seconds isn't all that much, so we could make it eight seconds for a start.

Hamanathnath

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #87 am: 3. Mai 2016, 16:33 »
Well that is good to know.  And yes, 5 seconds does seem pretty short, so I support making it longer. 

Maybe it does say that now in the English Version too.  I just don't remember seeing that.  I'll check as soon as I can.

FedeH

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #88 am: 5. Mai 2016, 22:36 »
Hey guys, i was just playing with dwarves and had an idea to "fix" the problem with the limit of 3 veterans and the mithril mails for the heroes.
Instead of killing a batallion of veterans in order to be able to send another party for a new one, we could use the spare ponies that lies around and combine them with the veterans to give them a new mithril mail, or start a cooldown of the ability of, IDK, 3 minutes, to allow a new mail to be given. This way you get enough mithril mails for your heroes without having to sacrifice a veterans batallion and you still have to keep your travel camp instead of destroying it as soon as you get your 3 veterans (this contrast with the idea of the veterans having a 10 minute straight cooldown for the mail)

what do you think?

The_Necromancer0

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Re: Dwarven Balance Discussion
« Antwort #89 am: 6. Mai 2016, 08:24 »
I don't know about how everybody feels about it but I think the Earthquake spell is too strong. The way I see it Tier10 powers should only be used as a massive support for an invasion or as a defensive measure, not as the driving edge for that invasion as displayed by Avalanche, The Vingilot and so many others. However the power of the earthquake is so that it destroys most economics buildings and heavily damages the rest, this leaves the player economically devastated at varying degree depending on map control. As an invasion support this is a great move but the thing is that it's a great move in general considering the cost of resource buildings inside the  base often upgraded with (in my case) pantry upgrades at either 300, 600 or both.

For that I was thinking that a couple minor changes could be made which focus on the effect of the earthquake as the incentive to get it rather than its raw power. This could include things like disabling/reducing defense, recruitment or resource gathering. It could also be stat wise, supporting the idea of an invasion booster where it lowers the armor of the buildings for a couple minutes. But overall I think the power of the earthquake should be lowered a bit so it leaves some health to economy buildings.
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