[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Dwarven Suggestions

The Dain Dilemma

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Radagast der Musikalische:
Our intention behind the exchange of the abilities is simple:
Every dwarven sub-faction has a different basic focus and the king and main support hero shouldn't act contrary to the basic direction of the faction, but strenghten its main focus. I know that many of you think that this contradicts the portrayal of Daín in BotFA, but we cannot base every concept on the movie adaptions, especially if it doesn't fit the main conception of the sub-faction. I cannot rule out that we might change some abilities, but I'm pretty sure that we will keep the current basic focus.

-DJANGO-:

--- Zitat ---I liked this versatility presented by the faction leader, providing contrasting benefits to the realm's specific playstyle.
--- Ende Zitat ---
  - Totally agree here!
Not only lore wise speaking, but also balance wise the switch was a wrong decision imo.

Especially Iron Hills needs speed abilities to compensate their weakness (for example, thats why im fine having them extra cav in form of ram riders)!
Erebor could nicely compensate their amor weakness with their main Hero. They dont need speedbuffs since they are in between ered luin & ironhills speed.
So at least switching Dains abilities back would be great. Atm their weaknesses are just too exposed.
With Ered Luin OP-Hero changes and Dain changes, Iron Hills and Erebor are now even weaker as they were before, compared to Ered Luin.

Odysseus:
I apologise for repeating myself, and Radagast is not responsible for such changes, so he should not be the one to take the brunt of our disapproval.

Nevertheless, as Django pointed out, in the current state, both realms have taken a relatively big hit to their flexibility and their strength to adapt to certain situations. Because of this change, the reliance on runes and towers is bigger than it should be, in my opinion, and it makes the factions more monotonous.

The majority of fans were very pleased with the previous implementation of the Old King Dain and Young King Dain. Furthermore, I cannot really remember reading many or any balance complaints on the English forums here. It was generally accepted and there were no complaints about it being broken, so I really do not understand why such a change was apparently necessary. It wasn't broken and didn't need fixing.

Currently, on the competitive level, people play Ered Luin the most, and if they don't they should, because they have by far the better heroes and more versatility than the other two dwarven realms combined. Compared to Ered Luin, the others are kind of one-trick ponies and feel a little boring/bland, in which the previous Dains provided some versatility to combat that blandness. To continue, Ered Luin can stage many plays via flanks and charges mitigating their frailty to a certain extent via pure speed, but the other factions had their leaders provide some sustenance. Especially Erebor, my main concern is Erebor, because they are an offensive faction, but they have the speed of a defensive one. If you want to be on the offensive, speed is just as crucial as attack. Iron Hills can soak up all the damage and still do decent damage on their own and therefore outlast a fight, but Erebor really hasn't anything particularly outstanding apart from the previous implementation of Old King Dain. Their damage is nothing insane, and their primary source of late-game sustain has now been removed. Dwarves are known for their tankiness, and to all degrees should have some of it in each faction that concerns Dwarves. This is just my point of view though, and I can imagine that it could be interpreted differently.

Dwarves were only OP in the previous iterations because they could get infinite heroic batallions (so glad that's gone), but the rest was fine really. I hope the Lord of Mordor hears our pleas :P

Walküre:

--- Zitat von: Radagast der Musikalische am 20. Aug 2016, 19:00 ---I know that many of you think that this contradicts the portrayal of Daín in BotFA, but we cannot base every concept on the movie adaptions, especially if it doesn't fit the main conception of the sub-faction.

--- Ende Zitat ---

It may sound a bit naïve, but my personal heart-based feeling is that Dáin (as the Lord of the Iron Hills) should go back to his past design, though gameplay-inaccurate it could be in regards to the new changes.

Contrary to the usual LOTR-based heroes and their relative factions, Dáin is a bit of an exception in the Mod: his graphical design and conceptual elements are completely fashioned on BOTFA and this fact is exactly what recreates the whole Iron Hills motive from the Hobbit trilogy (along with the overhauled units) in the actual game. The reference to the particularity of that film is of paramount importance to the entire faction's essence (undoubtedly, what people enjoy about this Dwarven realm).

Of course, it's not that Dáin's concept has been totally deprived of all of those properties overnight. In my opinion, though, sticking to the BOTFA atmosphere as much as we can is a central issue; that is, stressing firmly his primary war-lord characterisation as the old design did so well. These are just my sincere thoughts on the matter  :)

kingsjewel:

--- Zitat von: lordoflinks am 20. Aug 2016, 10:17 ---Is there any official word on this topic?
And what do people think of replacing Young Dain's Barracks ability with Thorin's company as a summon?

--- Ende Zitat ---
I think the problem is that Thorin and the company are available in an another dwarf faction. It wouldn't be 'too much'?

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