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Autor Thema: Upvoting Suggestions  (Gelesen 400 mal)

Offline Saeros

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Upvoting Suggestions
« am: 9. Dez 2016, 10:11 »
I really have no idea where I should put this so forgive me if I misplaced it.
This idea has nothing to do with the game but with the union page.

As the title says whould it be possible for something like an upvote button for subjects, or comments in each thread?
This way most people who just want to say they agree with a proposal or an idea in general won't have to write too much and at the same time those who are managing the mod can see easily how many are in favor or against each idea.

Can something like that be included in the page functionality?

Offline DieWalküre

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Re: Upvoting Suggestions
« Antwort #1 am: 9. Dez 2016, 10:26 »
I don't really think that would be a very good idea, for a few reasons. This forum works as a true and proper forum, where people are exactly supposed to and gently invited to express their own views, via providing arguments and enabling debates to take place. This should be the common approach to adopt. The voting system functions well (although with some implications regarding order) on ModDB, but that is due to the fact that the platform is mainly meant for showcasing (proposals are in fact mostly ignored there, and they are not likely to start useful discussions either).

By the way, speaking about showing people's direct support, there already is the right feature for this on Modding Union: polls. Nevertheless, as I pointed out earlier, users are still recommended to debate things and try to give more detailed feedback, instead of simplistic votes or agree/disagree statements. Polls themselves were under discussion among Moderators and we decided to limit their usage within reasonable terms. Discussion is paramount here.

Offline Saeros

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Re: Upvoting Suggestions
« Antwort #2 am: 9. Dez 2016, 17:20 »
I think that things would be simpler and easier for everyone..
Let's say I like an idea, but at the same time do not want to jump into the discussion, or just type "+1" or whatever. The upvote would let everyone know that I'm into the idea thus making decisions been taken faster and more easily!
Anyway it was just a thought that l thought helpful.

Offline DieWalküre

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Re: Upvoting Suggestions
« Antwort #3 am: 9. Dez 2016, 20:35 »
I perfectly know where you come from, believe me. My whole Edain-journey began exactly on ModDB. I know very well how the voting system functions there. The fact is that things just don't need to be necessarily 'easier and faster' here; ModDB and Modding Union are two very different contexts, as I explained to you above.

Here, we seek for proposing concepts, establishing debates and making sure that people share their thoughts with everyone else. It's only via debating that a proposal can really flourish and be developed properly, as it is submitted to multiple judgements and so chances for possible improvements are quite high (alongside flaws being unveiled and corrected); this is how most of the great proposals of this forum saw light. Very rarely is a concept born already perfect and completely crystalline. It would be quite naïve to think that it is so. Discussion is inevitably needed.

A simplistic voting system couldn't do so much for improving suggestions or convincing the Edain Team of the propriety of those same ideas. Also, as a secondary point, polls used to be exactly misused as an excuse not to participate in the threads involved. Both polls and votes are not fully reliable either. Someone once created multiple accounts to influence the poll which concerned Tauriel's presence in the game. These issues should be taken into careful consideration as well.

Offline Saeros

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Re: Upvoting Suggestions
« Antwort #4 am: 10. Dez 2016, 00:05 »
If you say so...
Thanks for your replies.
I thought that would be a good idea, apparently it's not!
We carry on!

Offline FG15

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Re: Upvoting Suggestions
« Antwort #5 am: 10. Dez 2016, 10:52 »
I'd like to talk a bit of the history of the forum.

Before 4.0 the concept discussions were structured in a quite different way.
There was only one discussion thread for each faction and most important of all, you could give your "Support" for a concept, to support it. Then the names of the supporters where edited into the concept text, and if a concept reached the support of 15 users, it would be moved to the "Concept Collection". The basic idea behind this was that the Edain Team does not need to read the whole thread and just read what the community approved of.

With the upcoming demo we compeltly replaced this system for two main reasons.
The first one was the new English community. Having to gather 15 supporters only to be heard, could really scare of new users, in particular if the English community is really small at that time.

The other more important point was exactly what DieWakküre already stated. The most important thing about a concept is the discussion. It will rarely happen, that everyone agrees completly with a concept, and there often doesn't exist a "finished" version. It happened that people gave their support, if XY is included or excluded in the concept, which made it really confusing. Also, when a concept already reached 10 of 15 supports, it made it much harder to try to improve some aspects, because all the 10 supporters had to give their supports again.

With the new system, we could solve these problems while keeping the basic idea, that it is not necessary to read everything (personally I still read 95% of all concepts and discussions), because the title of a thread allows it to directly see what it is in it, and if the suggestion is worth reading.


Now, why I think that a voting system would be a bad idea.
If a concept is so good, that everyone agrees that is good, it does not need any further support or upvotes.
Else, if there is a discussion with different ideas, just upvoting an idea without giving arguments, won't help at all, because the arguments behind it are the important points.
Please not, that just because a post gets a lot of votes does not make it's content any better or more true, in particular if this vote system is anonymous. That is the reason why such vote systems and polls shouldn't be used to get decissions.