[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] General Suggestions

Smaug, the Chiefest and Greatest of Calamities

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AulëTheSmith:

--- Zitat von: dkbluewizard am 20. Nov 2017, 12:37 ---The issue here is there is no resistance factor like in the books. If Smaug uses the ability, the hero is controlled. I just see that as too powerful, and as far as uniqueness goes. Wormtongue did it.

--- Ende Zitat ---

That's why I want to adapt and reshape the Sauron's concept in favour to Smaug  ;) In that concept you have three possible effect and they depend actually on the resistance of the characters. In fact want to change is the dependent variable: instead of the level, I would make the power of the hero the real variable that counts. Such that for 2500-3000 heroes like witch King, Gandalf, Saruman, etc it would be almost impossible to fall in the case one (total temporary conversion). For example it could be 10% of probability to fall in case one, 40% in case 2, 60% in case 3.
For scout heroes instead, the probability to be converted (fall in case one), would be very high, smething like 70%.
For middle cost heroes (1200 to 2000) same probability of 33,333% to fall in one of the three cases.
Ring heroes (while wearing the ring) are totally excluded from hypnotic gaze.

I get your point about ring wraiths and wraith in general. The fact is, if we are speaking about lore only, then Nazgul shouldn't take damage from common weapon, neither from arrow I think. Also power like the cripple effect of Lurtz should not have any effect on Nazgul. if we take into account lore only. The fact is, lore is only one of the important things we have to take into account, but also game play and technical feasibility. A good concept is the one that is a good trade off between these three components.
In conclusion of that, I would make them very resistant but not totally unaffected, for game play reason.

NoldorSithLordsShipwrigh t Can I count you as in favour?

dkbluewizard:
Yes Aule, but then you are saying there is a 10% chance of taking over Saruman, Sauron, etc. which I don't think Smaug could do that, especially since the whole premise of Smaug fighting on the MM faction's side is that he is doing it for Sauron.

Well fire arrows, water, light, and elbereth all affected nazgul which is shown by the physicality of the computer game.

Case in point, Smaug's ability as it stands is too powerful, even with the 10% chance factor--there is no way Smaug would be able to take over heroes like Sauron, Saruman, Gandalf, Galadriel, WK, etc. not only is it not canonical, it makes him OP in a game sense.

OakenShield224:
I'd just like to say how much I love this idea. You have my support AulëTheSmith.
In terms of the hero conversion ability, I agree that some heroes shouldn't be affected by the ability. I'd say all Ring Heroes aren't affected by the ability. For all other heroes, there is a 33% chance that they are converted. If they aren't converted, they are weakened for a small time (e.g. abilities recharge slower, slower attack speed, and reduced experience gain).

AulëTheSmith:

--- Zitat von: OakenShield224 am 20. Nov 2017, 18:19 ---I'd just like to say how much I love this idea. You have my support AulëTheSmith.
In terms of the hero conversion ability, I agree that some heroes shouldn't be affected by the ability. I'd say all Ring Heroes aren't affected by the ability. For all other heroes, there is a 33% chance that they are converted. If they aren't converted, they are weakened for a small time (e.g. abilities recharge slower, slower attack speed, and reduced experience gain).

--- Ende Zitat ---

I'll count on you as in favour  :)
I think at this point we all agree about excluding Ring bearers, so that point is quite consolidated.

About Sauron I could agree (I had not taken him in to account yet), dkblue, as an exceptional case. He's way powerful Maia in magical term, and also given his multiples shapes i cannot see him as a target of this ability. Sauron himself cuold manipulate Smaug, and not the contrary. (That is what would have probably happened if Smaug was still alive during war of the ring, It was the reason why Gandalf support the quest of erebor after all).
A part of him, the discussion is open and cannot be closed easily. Even for Saruman and Gandalf. Despite they still are superior creatures, being maiar, due to their human form they still have weaknesses. In particular I deem Saruman the most corruptible and controllable of the two. It's my opinion don't take it as personal ;)
I'm glad to hear any opinion about the matter  :)

dkbluewizard:
Aule you are as congenial as ever. But you said ring bearers, and Gandalf, Saruman, Galadriel, and Elrond all bear rings of power. I doubt anyone from the White Council would be affected.

Like I said before, I am in favor of this actually being a thing, but as discussed and as Oakenshield pointed out, there needs to be a list of heroes who wouldn't be affected. The ring heroes even without the One Ring in their possession, should not be affected (again Theoden, Thorin, and Boromir would be the exceptions).

So how about you make a list of the heroes that would and wouldn't be affected and we may all have something better to draw upon. If you are saying that just heroes who actually bear the One Ring, then the ability is too powerful--if you are just saying ring heroes...then okay I guess, but for reasons stated earlier I don't think Smaug could do that to some of the other heroes.

Let me know--I am actually IN FAVOR IF there are limitations placed on the ability.

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