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Autor Thema: Edain 4.5: General Feedback  (Gelesen 4662 mal)

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« am: 25. Jan 2020, 20:04 »
As always, we're eager to hear what you think of the version, which parts you like especially and which parts could use improvement!

Aranruth

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #1 am: 26. Jan 2020, 04:59 »
Excited to be the first on this thread to congratulate the Edain Team for their great work on 4.5!!!  :)

One question on Imladris: I seem to recall a discussion(and believe I read it on the Edain Mod Wiki less than a week ago) about 4.5 bringing a new siege unit to the people of Rivendell, but I see that didn't end up happening...

Does anyone else recall this being brought up, and if my memory did not fail me, maybe the Edain Team could shed some light on the reasoning behind not doing so? I get that they have two in the loremaster and catapult, but I certainly would have liked to see a third thrown in there  xD

Would love to hear the reasoning behind not going that route though. Edain Team seems to know what they're doing, after all  ;)

Mr.Todd

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #2 am: 27. Jan 2020, 20:17 »
Hello Edain Team  :) I repost my comment here, I'm sorry if my english is not perfect, I have a lot of things to say about 4.5!
After more than 3 hours of games I can tell you that I am very happy with the result.
The AI is amazing, very hard and smart even in medium, the balance is at the top, I am happy to see that my army is not slaughtered in few seconds by a defensive tower, it's a good point! Most of the heroes are now super well balanced, the price changes are very significant. The new spells are also very good, very strategic, it's perfect.
Regarding the economic system, it is very well thought, and the idea of ​​putting an active defense capacity in resource structures is genius.
I have some generals comments for you, I think the update time for the forged tools is a bit long, and maybe too expensive in the library, and the begining of the game for Imladris is not easy without Erestor's help because Imladris units are exepensive. I also have the impression that some spells last now too long: the army of the dead for example, they stay a long time on the battflield and our army has no chance of survival.
Concerning the balance it is very good but I find that the Ash ents do enormous damage to farms, in two hits they can destroy a level 3 farm. Regarding the Isengard I would have liked Saruman to be able to have 100% magical dammage as Gandalf but it doesn't matter.
Apart from these few details it is a pleasure to play !!

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #3 am: 27. Jan 2020, 20:49 »
I get that they have two in the loremaster and catapult, but I certainly would have liked to see a third thrown in there  xD
They can also build rams from the Dunedain outpost, so they already are at three^^
If any improvements need to be made, it'll probably be Loremasters.

kreso

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #4 am: 29. Jan 2020, 00:47 »
Hello Edain team,

I'm here just to say BIG THANK YOU for your work and dedication to the mod. Really nice to see some ideas from fans came trough, even few of my own.
It is early to give some tweaks, but surely I will play mod offline/online to give feedbacks. This is almost new mod, not a patch hahaha.
As Imladris main, one thing that I think it could be problematic is economy, not sure that Erestor late game could be implemented very effectively since they have strongest late game of all factions. Imladris had relatively bad early game in previous patch (creeping only one camp at the time, weak scout hero in terms of stats, very expensive pikes to own map against cavalry). Even putting Erestor with lvl 2 Library will not help early game, because it was main thing for Imladris early game. Not sure yet how strong the economy is after Library change, maybe it is even stronger than in the previous patch. Good thing You reduce micro economy with this change it is good for casual play. In some match ups (like Mordor to counter orc spam or Rohan to counter cavalry spam) I want to spam soldiers in early game and I used Erestor to buff production but that is gone now. Not effective to go double racks in the main, especially with less plots than the others. Please take care of that. Maybe reducing production time for 20%?

Usual path was build one forge and get very early upgrades and buff that forge for resources. This was secure way to transition from early game to mid game, where Imladris shine.

That thing in the new patch when you get Library you also get forge lvl 2 and upgrades is crucial thing.

Thank You one more time, hopefully there is still player base around mod.
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Le Sournois

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #5 am: 29. Jan 2020, 21:06 »
I have not played very much at the moment but I am very impressed of all that revamp.
I mean, Imladris in Edain 4.4 was my least favourite faction, not bad, but no that interesting to play, I had the feeling the Library was not as representative of Imladris as Sauron is for Mordor. And now the Library is really well done, doesn't produce a humongous amount of ressources any more which is very good but nonetheless improve your eco and army and can led to wonderful strategies as interesting as you can have with Sauron in Mordor.

And there is a lot of similar good choices in terms of strategy for all the factions with economy (lumbermills...), with defense (Isengard sentry Wargs..), with offense (Gondor Shields...) and some very original ideas (Lothlorien abiliy in stealth mode...). The Central Spell is such a good idea to make all the skirmish more intense and more strategic.

Another thing I like is that you got rid of all the last random factors which were a bit frustrating when they didn't work as we wanted (Wormtongue in Orthanc and the Signal fires for Gondor).

Maybe I'm too enthusiastic as I have not played a lot, but for the moment I'm impressed.

The only small reproach I could do is that command points are increased maybe too easily. The new system is very nice, I don't put it into question, but something like a progressive cost would be interesting. It's the same cost to get from 500 to 700 CP and to get from 1300 to 1500 CP when I think it should be a little bit harder at the end. But that's a very small thing.

Congratulations, Edain team !



Laggy22

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #6 am: 30. Jan 2020, 22:34 »
I had a skirmish game go more than an hour on Fords of Isen II in a bitter stalemate, only to have the map spawn thousands of wildmen and ballistas to attack both the computer and I. Fortunately for me, I was winning the war of attrition and the surge of wildmen was too much for the AI to recover from.

Is this an easter egg of some sort? I thought it was fun because I won. Not a horde map so it was unexpected. Anyway, you guys are super great and this mod is fantastic. I've had a blast playing it so far and it all seems very well thought out and balanced. That game the wildmen ended was a really fun game because of how well balanced Mordor and Gondor were. Rock solid.

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #7 am: 30. Jan 2020, 22:42 »
It is not an easteregg, but a map feature.^^ Actually one of the oldest ones, I think it was already in 3.0 or something like that. :D Glad you like it! :)

Chrishedges

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #8 am: 1. Feb 2020, 11:54 »
I must say this is a fantastic upgrade, I have enjoyed playing it the last few days. Loving the new spell books and the strategic changes to Lothlorien and Galadriel, I am a bit sad to see Frodo and Sam have been dropped, Frodo didn’t offer much but I did like sam’s gardener ability so you could plant mallorn trees wherever you wanted, not sure if there is a way to reintroduce this or not but not a deal breaker. I have also noticed though that custom ranger hero’s have a really strange colour scheme going on and I can’t change the colour of there equipment, is this a bug or an intended change, as I would say the colours match Mordor more then Gondor or any good side?
It's a dangerous thing walking out of your front door frodo, you never know where the road may take you.

The_Necromancer0

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #9 am: 1. Feb 2020, 12:00 »
It is a bug that will be fixed soon.
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GildorInglorion

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #10 am: 10. Feb 2020, 19:14 »
Imladris AI is weak due to its not understanding lore masters' support roles. The thing is, they use lore masters too bad. Lore masters are solo, AI use them as other soldiers, so they die easily and the money spent to them becomes a waste. I think each lore master should come with two elven soldiers guarding him passively and middle spell on spellbook should also unlock another passive to lore masters as giving them %25 more arrow resistance or something. That way AI can use them better.

LilJur

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #11 am: 13. Feb 2020, 23:54 »
Got around 6 hours into the new game now and played Horde maps with all factions and skirmishes with Imlardis, Gondor and Angmar.

First of all, great work on everything. To me, it feels like one of the most completed and less buggiest mods there is.
The economic system is great. It makes every faction feel different enough to have enough variety in gameplay and I hope this will be expanded upon in the future with more unique upgrades for every faction. I do think some upgrades take to long, like the tools. (would you please consider a upgrade where your siege weapons do not damage your own troops and buildings? Return of Shadow for BFME1 has it and it is a blessing!)

The spellbook is ok-ish. I really like some of the spells and some less, but I think this is more because of my play style.

Than there is Imladris.
I feel they aren't as good as they could be. I played as Imladris vs Angmar. The game lasted almost 2 hours because I simply would not come to strength.
When I played as Gondor or Angmar vs 3 AIs, the games lasted just under an hour.
One of the reasons I think, is their squad size. All battalions of Imladris are 5 units.
All other factions have 10-15 units in their battalions and only 5 units in their elite battalions. Now, one could argue Imladris has 5 units because their units are strong.
But I feel they aren't strong. Some types of units take up even more CP than their equivalent of other factions, yet their equivalent will beat them 1 on 1.

I do like how this mod has added a lot of siege things. It is however very unfortunate these cannot be put to good use. My suggestion would be to look at Return of Shadow for BFME1. They increased building hitpoints and made swords and regular arrows less effective against them. It can literately take minutes to destroy a building if you do not use catapults, axes or fire arrows. This makes sieges and siege engines more relevant.

Bugs?
One thing that really bothered me is how ineffective archers are on walls.
When you put archers on the walls on BFME1, they stay where you've put them down. For some reason, the archers in this mod keep walking around. They walk around the walls, the go from the walls to the courtyard and back, they go all over the place and don't stay. I can't even use postal gates because if I do, the archers will go through the gate to attack the enemies instead of staying on the wall to shoot them.

Another thing I noticed; wall mounted trebuchets will automatically acquire all targets (even though they miss every shot) except other trebuchets.
Playing as Gondor and fighting Gondor, I noticed they would never auto acquire any trebuchets in range, I had to manually select them.

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #12 am: 14. Feb 2020, 00:37 »
If you press the "S" button, any selected units will stop moving until they get a new order. You can use it for archers on walls to stop them from running around. Put them into offensive stance as well for good measure.

GildorInglorion

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #13 am: 14. Feb 2020, 17:12 »
If you put archers in defensive stance they will not auto attack, but if you put them agressive stance they will attack when an enemy enters their range and they will not move(will not chase the enemy) if enemy leaves their range, but of course they will be more vulnerable since their armor will decrease on agressive stance.

But one of the advantages of defensive stance is, I think, your archers will only auto attack to enemy archers who attacking your defensive stance archers. So with this way your archers automatically will kill enemy archers first, then you can command them to kill the other battalions of the enemy.
« Letzte Änderung: 14. Feb 2020, 17:15 von GildorInglorion »

dgsgomes

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #14 am: 17. Feb 2020, 20:23 »
I will try to be more generic in the feedback; more specific questions will be left for another time and in more opportune places

I already made it very clear how satisfied I was with the release of version 4.5, I really liked the addition of new units, the new spellbook, the bug fixes, the new economy system, the new maps, and so on.

In this context, however, although I have enjoyed many of the changes involving the siege update, there are some points that I consider important for making sieging in Edain more satisfying; currently, we have players who don't care about siege and, in the face of unlikely game situations, prefer to simply declare the "gg" and start another game, and we have players, like me, who think the siege premise is fantastic and that wants the opportunity to see it perfected in the game.

Well, after this introduction, below are some aspects of sieging that I consider relevant to be discussed:


1. Siege weapons are generally produced from far away from the enemy base and move slowly, which makes sieging tedious - with rare exceptions, such as Lothlorien, who produces Beornings and Ents in settlements and has much more flexibility in choosing where to produce their siege weapons, what happens in games is that when an enemy is forced to retreat to his defenses because he has lesser military strength, moments of long wait start from the production of expensive siege weapons at the attacker's initial base (which often need to destroy other constructions to start making siege weapons), until they move to the enemy base; if these siege weapons are destroyed, the long process is repeated. Would it be an option to extend Lothlorien's dynamics involving siege weapons to other factions? Historically, siege weapons did not normally travel long distances, but were prepared/assembled close to the enemy's base. For me, this is a major issue.


2. Towers remain very efficient in Edain, especially those that can be produced in large quantities, and this reduces the dynamics of the sieges - although they have suffered a reduction in health and an increase in price, the towers usually remain quite threatening; Castle with many towers (like Mordor and Isengard) and even Camps (including Rohan) almost completely prevent enemy direct attack, as the damage output from the towers remains very high and can decimate armies without strong upgrades. Another advantage for these factions is that they are able to gradually acquire these defense towers, while in the walled Castles, although the towers are efficient and resistant, they require a very high initial investment (700) which in many scenarios is not accessible. Would it be possible to further reduce the damage of the towers against units (with the exception of heroes, who are already highly resistant to towers) a possible solution? With the current potential of the towers, siege battles are often limited to siege weapons (the attacker with the army away from the wall, using battering rams or catapults until they reach a freer path to the opposing citadel).


3. The versatility of the siege involving other means, especially troops, has been little explored - this fact has much to do with the previous point, if the towers are so much stronger, I will seek to attack my enemy from a distance, in this case, I choose catapults; the opponent sees that I am attacking purely with catapults, sees that there is no need to place archers on the wall, as they will not normally cause significant damage to siege weapons and are extremely vulnerable to catapults, and either expect me to destroy his gate or it produces a catapult on the wall to retaliate mine, and there the battle continues at a distance. Another important point is that alternative resources, such as stairs or siege towers, are shy about the fact that simply breaking the gate always seems like a better alternative; Castle gates are currently quite vulnerable, and if the enemy has not prepared for an enemy invasion by building defenses on its walls, it is much better to simply break down the front door. In that sense, if gates were more resistant, wouldn't it be more interesting to surprise the enemy with tunnels / stairs / siege towers to invade before it is actually possible to destroy the gate? Of course, added to that, the gate would need to be repaired much more slowly. Well, these alternative resources must be explored, including plans for the Goblins to also have tunnel-digging systems to invade enemy bases.

Bug (?): The archs on the side of Imladris Castle prevent siege towers from being able to stick and function properly, and may need to be removed (or at least reduced in length)


4. Lothlorien's base is very vulnerable, especially in Camps, where the citadel has the same health as the citadels of other factions, besides being a much bigger and easier target to attack, not having walls around and having fragile defenses, with archers that cannot be controlled to attack specific targets; furthermore, even if the attached buildings remain intact, by destroying the citadel without another base elsewhere on the map, the player is automatically defeated

Bug (?): Beorning hut does not count as military construction, and therefore its presence alone does not prevent a player with Lothlorien from losing when his Camp citadel is destroyed.


5. Denethor remains an extremely effective counter against siege weapons in general, especially catapults, and this is a potentially irritating factor. Is it a possible solution to reduce the range of your attacks? Reduce your damage against siege weapons? Make sure you don't gain range bonuses when over the wall? Frankly, I have no idea - but something definitely needs to be changed.


Well, all that said, I'm very pleased with the work done so far, and I'd like to congratulate Edain Team for this patch.

Thanks for the attention  :)

ZipeviL

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #15 am: 2. Mär 2020, 14:31 »
Greetings
Now i will be honest i have no idea how much time i have invested into this mod, i'm sure it is an unhealthy amount of time.
That how much i loved it .
I never used to play with other factions but in edain every faction was so different that it intrigued me enough to try out some of the other ones and i really enjoyed it.
Now after countless hours and anticipation for the next update it finally came
4.5
HOWEVER man i was disappointed .
I have been playing 4.5 since the release day and i've been trying to understand the new changes and "improvements" but so far its going nowhere for me.
The economy update seems decent enough , the power tree is very nice indeed although some powers i feel are underwhelming but man the siege, its atrocious.
One catapult is all it takes to win the game now for the AI opponent, that's it.
Reducing the command points was also devastating ,while increasing the CP cost of most heroes?Why?
So many unnecessary changes in my opinion but the fact is i'm not having fun with it anymore.
And so 4.5 was mediocre at best for me.
Then 4.5.2 came out and Angmar is unplayable now.
Just from a few games in 4.5.2 i came to the conclusion that someone must really dislike angmar and someone else really likes rohan.
And so in angmar :

wights were already nerfed unreasonably in  4.5 and  in 4.5.2 are completely useless
they were already super slow and now they don't even damage cavalry? yet i bet beornings STILL destroy whatever they come across be it buildings units or heroes without breaking any sweat.
On the other hand angmars sorcerers stayed the same as did the factions' leader which makes him the most underpowered and uninteresting hero to use.
the only useful skill he has is his horse so he can Run Away from every fight, yeah.
and many many more  and lastly rohans new favorite unit is :

C A T A P U L T S

which when they hit angmars towers they hit 2-3 buildings at once(a tower,a resource or unit building and the camps walls).

As i said at the beginning i'm being honest here and while 4.4.1 had a bunch of issues i feel i was having much more fun .

The_Necromancer0

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #16 am: 2. Mär 2020, 14:48 »
Hello and welcome to the forums  :)

Feedback is always welcome but before anybody responds to yours I would like to point out that Edain is primarily balanced for PvP games, even when it is sometimes at the detriment of PvE games. The changes in 4.5 were aimed at making PvP, specifically 1v1, more balanced, please keep this in mind while providing feedback. As the AI cheats heavily and doesn't possess the skill of a player it can make it harder to play against them, you may have to change the way you played against the AI to adapt to the new 4.5 balance. Also, when providing feedback, make sure to be specific, you mentioned that you felt certain powers were underwhelming, which powers specifically and why did they feel underwhelming?

A final note, the Team has mentioned they are unhappy with the current Witch-King of Angmar and they will be overhauling him at some point alongside the central power of Angmar. If you have any ideas on how to improve him that you feel are in line with Edain's general design philosophy make sure to write them down too.
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Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #17 am: 2. Mär 2020, 15:48 »
First of all, thanks for the honest feedback. I assume you are reffering to the bugged economy of Angmar when you're saying it's unplayable; we released a hotfix that solves this issue. You can read about it here. Simply update your game through the Edain launcher and the bug should be fixed. There are a few points I'd like to point out however:

Wights weren't nerfed. If anything, they are more attractive now due to the changes to their lairs. In fact, several players have been using them to great effect and even suggested a price increase.
Angmar's sorcerers didn't stay the same, their abilities got buffed. Corpse Rain, just to give you an example, does more damage now.
Catapults do half the damage to your fortress compared to 4.4.1 due to the citadel bonus. Defensive wall catapults are now an amazing option to fight them because they deal increased damage to single targets.

AulëTheSmith

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #18 am: 4. Mai 2020, 14:20 »
I'm writing here, but the post can be evetually moved in the specific Dain and the One Ring feedback thread as soon as will be created:

Hi ET,

I have no words, of course to describe how happy i am :) Our proposal has finally seen the light and be implemented. Wow. Beside reitroducing an old character which the most of the community is fond of, the theme of the last king of the dwarves and his Khazad-Dûm quest is a wonderful lore addion.

The required tasks are even simpler, in my opinion, with respect to the original suggestion. So in the end the whole mechanic should not be so complicated during game, but i rely to the words of testers on the matter :)
Really like the reintroduction of the old Mithril Workshop by the way :)

Furthermore, i can read a "4.5 - logic" behind the design of Durin VII mechanic:

- if the player want to play in a fast and aggressive way without completing the tasks, still a valuable set of abilities can be exploited, even if with reduced effect. All of this at the cost of let Durin VII gaining experience by his own in the middle of the battle, taking some risk. Also, being careful about powerful enemy heroes that could kill him easely at low levels.

- if the player has a long term tactic and will endure completing the missions, the results will be rewarding brining back all the ancient might of the Forefathers.

So, both short and long term strategies are possible :)

Few questions for you, will Durin lost all his experince once is killed? (i probably forgot to mention this issue in the suggestion). I suppose yes. That would be a point in favor of balance, eving an extra-hero at our side. It was also like this in past versions for Durin I,am i right?

Also, second question, how exactly will work the Mithril Workshop? It unlocks the Mithril Coat avoiding to use the system camp.+Veterans?

Concerning Dain Ironfoot, the new temper is far more interesting than before in my humble opinion, and it was needed after the rework. Scorched Earth ability seems devasting but has to be used carefully, while is great the way you bring back Vendetta, which evokes the slain of Azog in the Battle of Azanulbizar.

 To conclude, i'd like to thank  everyone in the community who participated in the debate and helped to implement the proposal of Durin VII. And of course you, ET.
This is the umpteenth proof that you always care about fans and their ideas.

It's another beam of light that breaks through the toxic fog that some "fans" have spread along this four years, mostly on moddb.

Looking forward to play 4.5.3.

Keep up the good work for what is to come

Sincerely grateful

Aulë

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #19 am: 4. Mai 2020, 15:05 »
I'm glad you like it xD

Durin will start over at level one if he dies in battle, yes.

After building the Mithril Workshop, you'll no longer need to send veterans into your forge to unlock the Mithril Mail for your heroes, exactly. Afterwards, the Workshop can build additional mines to generate lots and lots of money, you can see those in the last picture.

Adrigabbro

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #20 am: 27. Jun 2020, 19:16 »
I'm not sure where to react to the many news we've received this week concerning 4.5.3, so I'll write my feedback here.

I'm very much looking forward to the new version regarding new changes and balance modifications. In particular the new settlements of Gondor, spellbook balance, the new variant spell mechanics (so cool!), the Overseer spell in the front row, splitting the Forged Tools upgrade, a bit more income during games, varying buildcosts for settlements and new heroes recruitment mechanics. I welcome all these changes!

Some questions/concerns:

1) Have you considered tweaking the Gondor barrage spell? It makes my computer very laggy even early in the game. Fro what it's worth, I also find this spell a bit out of place.

2) If anything it looks like you have nerfed Lorien spellbook even though it was already commonly considered as the weakest spellbook among the PvP community.  In particular the second defensive spell is a bit redundant with the central spell and its mechanism feels off. What is your opinion ?

3) Is there any consequence of increasing the in game camera height regarding lags ?

Thank you for your time.


"That still only counts as one!"

Gnomi

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #21 am: 27. Jun 2020, 19:50 »
Zitat
3) Is there any consequence of increasing the in game camera height regarding lags ?

If you are talking about 1sv1, you will notice basically 0 difference, as nearly all of the 1vs1 maps already had a height of 550-600.
Otherwise increasing the camera height will obviously always interfere with things like game smoothness, but most other bigger mods also had a much higher camera than Edain had, so it will not be completely new terrain for all of us. :)
But as we said in the article: Such things can only be tested on a larger scale and we will adjust the height according to the feedback we receive.^^

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #22 am: 27. Jun 2020, 20:59 »
Some questions/concerns:

1) Have you considered tweaking the Gondor barrage spell? It makes my computer very laggy even early in the game. Fro what it's worth, I also find this spell a bit out of place.

2) If anything it looks like you have nerfed Lorien spellbook even though it was already commonly considered as the weakest spellbook among the PvP community.  In particular the second defensive spell is a bit redundant with the central spell and its mechanism feels off. What is your opinion ?
  • Not really until now, I haven't heard of the lag problem before. Is this something others have encountered as well?
  • I think the dwarven spellbook was usually considered to be even weaker :D
    I personally feel that the offensive tree is incredibly powerful, Radagast and the Queen of Twilight have enormous destructive potential and the Arrow Volley can be used in some really nice wombo-comboes. Tauriel is often underrated, she's fantastic against high-value targets, and with the Blessing now working as intended in 4.5.3 (it used to bug out a lot before) and the changes to the River, the long-term spelltree should be quite a bit stronger as well. What would you change about Refuge in the Woods?

Adrigabbro

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #23 am: 27. Jun 2020, 23:49 »
Guess I have a wooden computer.  :(

The main issue I encounter with Refuge in the Woods is actually using it. Sometimes I can't even click on trees which are just in front of my base. It's like I have to move the cursor over one specific pixel otherwise nothing happens. Also I believe there is no clear indicator whether or not the tree is too far from the base. As you will agree you can't afford wasting precious seconds in real time strategy games.

Or perhaps I have been too dumb to use it. Any tips ?


"That still only counts as one!"

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #24 am: 28. Jun 2020, 12:32 »
We'll see if we can make some tweaks to the spell to make the placement easier, it definitely shouldn't be so tedious to use.

Le Sournois

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #25 am: 29. Jun 2020, 01:13 »
Graphism in Edain 4.5.3 are beautiful. That's put a real good atmosphere in the game.
The new system of wells "reinforcements" based on feedbacks is really nice.

But there is 2 remarks I would like to say :

For each factions, there is a difference between camp start and castle start except for one faction : Isengard.
Isengard is really a "camp start" faction, it has a very good camp, but the castle is just the same thing with more buildplot (8 instead of 6 but every factions get more builplots in castle start).
Mordor has aditionnal buildplots to use in castle start. All the factions with wall have a clear advantage in Siege defence.

That's a sign of unbalance in my opinion. If the game is balanced in camp start, then in castle start, Isengard which get no bonus compared to other factions is logically disadvantaged.

Maybe there are some way to make feel this is castle start even for Isengard. I had thought of making the big Warg sentry (3 wargs) available again in the main buildplots only in castle start but maybe there are other ways if this one is not chosen.

Another remark, a trivial thing maybe, but heroic statues are not available in camp start for Gondor, but are available for Rohan. Why all the Heroic statues are not then bannished from camp start ?

Thanks Edain for this new version. The economic system was good but it is now even better (it seems so after one day).


Palpou

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #26 am: 1. Jul 2020, 11:45 »
Looks amazing, I love the new icons for units and building.
I tried Isengard and Gondor for now.
It is a good idea to give rangers back to archery.
It's a bit weird that heroes are not centralized anymore but it's just the time to get used to it. And makes more sense.
Thank you for you hard work making this mod an ultimate must have.
« Letzte Änderung: 1. Jul 2020, 21:51 von Palpou »

EgyptRaider

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #27 am: 29. Aug 2020, 13:23 »
Hi all,

I recently discovered this mod and the experience so far has been so so so amazing! I really applaud you all for the dedication to this project and all the beautiful designs both graphic and gameplay-wise.

Going through the game I encountered some thing text-wise that I thought I could provide some feedback on (not sure it would rather be bug reports). Mostly I encountered some typos or weird capitalisations in the map descriptions. I could provide a list of them or send an image file with all the screepcaptures of it -- in case anyone is interested in doing something with it :)

Furthermore I noticed some German 'slips' here and there -- most notibly in the integrated costum hero who has Heerfuhrer in his name, and the fact that at least one costum hero (the Elven lord) speaks German when brought in the game.

Finally, I was wondering how much you want/can mod the AI? I think I've read in a couple of places that it's quite hard. So is it a thing to give feedback on in general?

That's it -- again all the kudos and can't wait for all the announced updates!!

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #28 am: 29. Aug 2020, 13:51 »
Hey, thanks for the kind words! Glad you like it.

Typos or text bugs in general you can just post in the bug threads here, there are different threads for each faction.

You can leave any AI feedback here and we'll see what we can do.

canadyan

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #29 am: 28. Sep 2020, 17:29 »
I know the Mod is generally balanced for PvP but is there any way to have the AI use all the powers in the Spellbooks? I play coop with my brother vs Brutal AI's but they don't seem to use much against us.

Halbarad

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #30 am: 28. Sep 2020, 20:44 »
Maybe not all but probably some more? To be honest I do think that they are using more then enough powers already. Especially when playing against multiple AIs (like 2vs3 or 2vs2vs2vs2 or something) it really makes more fun to me to only fight the armies and not the spells, especially when things like 2 earthquakes can destroy your whole base without you being able to counter it.
On the other hand, if so badly wanted it could be changed to a way, where only brutal AI uses them and hard AI doesn't while not being worse in other ways.

Elendils Cousin 3. Grades

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #31 am: 28. Sep 2020, 23:38 »
"Balancing" is done for pvp because the AI is not human and therefore doesn't play like a human, creating an inherent imbalance in pve gameplay. That doesn't mean that we aren't constantly working on improving the AI or the pve experience in general. The two aren't mutually exclusive^^

When I play vs the AI, they use pretty much all the spells barring some exceptions (the AI can't handle Mordor's reinforcements so we had to disable them, just to give you an example). Are you encountering this against specific factions or on specific maps? The brutal AI should be using spells quite liberally.

canadyan

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #32 am: 2. Okt 2020, 18:54 »
"Balancing" is done for pvp because the AI is not human and therefore doesn't play like a human, creating an inherent imbalance in pve gameplay. That doesn't mean that we aren't constantly working on improving the AI or the pve experience in general. The two aren't mutually exclusive^^

When I play vs the AI, they use pretty much all the spells barring some exceptions (the AI can't handle Mordor's reinforcements so we had to disable them, just to give you an example). Are you encountering this against specific factions or on specific maps? The brutal AI should be using spells quite liberally.

My bad, I should have been more detailed. They quantity of their spell use is fine (we get hit constantly, it's fun) but I meant that we don't see all of the specific spells being used. Mordor's Reinforcements was the exact spell I had in mind. We were hoping to see Men of the East in our battles with Morder but it sounds like that's not possible against the AI. Thanks for the responses!

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #33 am: 2. Okt 2020, 19:14 »
We had Mordor's reinforcements in 4.5.3 or 4.5.2, because the AI wasn't able to use them consistently and unfortunately, there's not much one can do about that. Sometimes they'd work fine, but often the reinforcements would just stand near the AI's base. But because they still take up commandpoints, the Mordor AI would just fizzle out over the course of the game and only send what little army they could get - but once you march on their base, there were three Mûmakil and six Haradrim Riders waiting [ugly]

For the time being, you'll have to play Mordor yourself or play against a human Mordor player to see them in action.

Le Sournois

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #34 am: 20. Okt 2020, 10:52 »
Even in 4.5.4 with a focus on horde maps, still the point breakdown system is bugged when you lose the control over the wall, you get more points when you should have less points (at least still on Minas Tirith on hard). But I give up reminding it, that is the last time.
Not interested in making a lot of defence points then. That's sad.

Nontheless, Edain is still the best mod of BFME in terms of game balance and interesting maps in my opinion.

Gnomi

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Re: Edain 4.5: General Feedback
« Antwort #35 am: 20. Okt 2020, 13:19 »
Zitat
Even in 4.5.4 with a focus on horde maps, still the point breakdown system is bugged when you lose the control over the wall, you get more points when you should have less points (at least still on Minas Tirith on hard). But I give up reminding it, that is the last time.

I just tested it multiple times and this is NOT the case.
You get more passive points after a fixed time, I think this happened to you.
Can you give a replay?

Just to be a bit more clear of what I mean:

On hard you get 2 points per second.
After defending 480 seconds you will get 4 points per second.
After 900 seconds you will get 6 points per second.
After 1400 seconds you will get 8 points per second.

Those points are independent on controll over the wall or gates.
In addition to that you get the following points:
4 points per second if your wall stands
4 points per second if your main door stands
4 points per second if both secondary gates stand.
As an example the script for the wall points is:
*** IF ***
     NOT Counter 'GG-FirstWallCounter' IS Less Than  1
*** THEN ***
  Counter 'GG-Points' , Add with counter 'GG-PointsCounterAdd2'

"GG-FirstWallCounter" is the counter which is shown (starting at 100, going down).
So it is rather clear here: If the counter is not less than 1 (so if the counter is equal or above 1), the points are added.