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Mordor Balance Discussion

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Max_Power:
Hi everyone! I generally agree with the previous posts. In my personal experience, Mordor is getting the eco upgrades generally quicker than other factions. The cost is much cheaper, even taking into account Nazgul etc.

Let's calculate it: Most factions need around 600-1000 for the research building, and then 1200 per eco upgrade (around 4200-4600 in total).
Now, Mordor can pay 1300 for Nazgul, 1000 for Sauron, and 800+500 for CU unit (around 3500 in total). Mordor upgrades also "research" quicker due to infuence of Sauron cooldown time.

Besides the eco upgrades, after paying all that money most factions get the benefit of having a forge, whereas Mordor has a hero, elite units and other very useful hero that cannot die (as Smeargollum Said, it is the same as if Gondor would get their upgrades by buying Aragorn and Gondor cav or Rangers).

So the Mordor eco upgrades seem cheap for me, even free at their core. Making them have some cost and potential research time would be ok for me (not necessarly as high as other factions, could be a cheap-quick one). As Mordor is a faction with many other free features, I don't see them having eco problems either. If we want to keep that "free thematic motive" for Mordor (which I don't understand even from lore point, maybe besides the free orcs), then other changes should be done to achieve a similar effect (I can think of moving Influence of Sauron to level 4, but I am not sure I like it).

Now, Mordor has other problems that would remain the same, mainly their high contrast between nearly trash [uglybunti] earlygame, and their megastronk [uglybunti] lategame.
Butaybe it is better to make changes slowly, since a new patch might come soon with more changes.

Aiphaton:
Hey guys,

another idea on another issue with Mordor‘s balance in the current patch:

Shelob.

While Shelob is extremly strong in the EG, she scales towards the later part of the match.

An idea to fix that might be the following:
- with every time Shelob spawns she gains two additional levels
- first time she spawns at level 3 with the tunnel-ability
- Second time at level 5
- third time at level 7 plus she can summon her breeded spiders
- fourth time at level 9
- from the fifth time on at level 10 with her full set of abilities

This would balance the very strong tier 2 spell and scale it throughout the entire match.
I don‘t think that this ability should be a hardcounter to so many abilities that early on.

Let me know what you think.
Aiphaton

dgsgomes:
I agree that Shelob is extremy strong, but I would'nt nerf her (as a unit) either and I don't know if technically is possible to make her spell work with such a level system.

I personally would just increase her cooldown timer significantly, so player would need to think carefully in what moments are they going to deal more damage with her and in what moments using her would be a wasted potential.

However, a change is indeed required.

Aiphaton:
A small edit:

In order for Shelob to keep her Herokiller-Role one could add the poison-sting on level 1 again which deals high damage vs heroes but isn’t applicable on untis.

Similar to Nazgul‘s morgul-Blade.

The_Necromancer0:
I want discuss two things in this post: The Evil Men Summons and Aiphaton's Shelob suggestion.

Shelob
I think there's a good idea in the concept but it needs some changes, currently it's not very practical as it would require 28 minutes of summoning Shelob back to back to actually get her to full strength. I think the first step is to introduce small changes to Shelob in order balance her.

For this her spider web needs its cooldown increased, currently it is 30 seconds which allows it to be case 3 times during her 80 second time. I think it should be increased to 60 seconds, the reason is that increasing so will punish users that don't summon shelob in the right position to be able to use the web won't be able to use it a second time.

Secondly, for the suggested change. I would cut it down to only three summons instead of 5. This would cut down the time to only 14 minutes if you summon shelob back to back.

Evil Men
The evil men summons are very strong and it's quite easy to get their upgrade since the defence banner is a very useful tool. Some of these ideas are originally from kmog but I adapted them slightly. The idea is to nerf the summon and the fact that they can't really be scouted for.

* Every player should be able to hear the sound effect so they know that the reinforcements have been called
* The units take longer to arrive after the button has been clicked to allow for more of an error margin for the enemy
* Casting IoS on the defense banner no longer grants upgrades for all the summons instead a system is devised based on the amount of banner that have IoS, up to three:
* 0 banners: Summons don't have any upgrades
* 1 banner: Upgrades for summons are unlocked, they can be purchased by the player once they arrive on the field
* 2 banners: For this there are two possible effects:

* Easterlings now arrive on the battlefield with their upgradesOR

* Both summons now arrive on the battlefield with one upgrade (either heavy armour or forged blades)
* 3 banners: similarly, two possible effects

* Haradrims now also arrive on the battlefield with their upgradesOR

* Both summons now arrive on the battlefield with both upgrades

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