[en] Edain Mod > [Edain] Imladris Suggestions

Imladris Balance Suggestions

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Elite KryPtik:

--- Zitat von: Hamanathnath am  4. Aug 2016, 01:28 ---Might as well jump into this discussion. 

The Lore-Masters have the potential of being very problematic.  If a person only buys 1 or 2, and doesn't go for a Combo that is too strong together, they are fine.  But in numbers, they can make fighting Imladris incredibly difficult, if not impossible.

I really like the abilities the Lore-Master have, but what you have to understand is that Lore-Masters don't have a limit past their argueably low command point cost.  The potential if having an any of those abilties used 4-5 or even more times every battle is too much, such as an incredible amount of heals for Water Lore-Masters, and especially the Speed Boost and Knockback Immunity for the Wind Lore Masters, allowing you to make escapes from spells like Army of the Dead whenever you want. 

And that doesn't even count the Combo Abilities, which are some of the strongest in the game, with Light-Wind and Earth-Wind being the Strongest in my opinion.

I think making the Lore-Masters cost 90 command points each, as well as nerfing certain Lore-Master abilties, will make them a lot more balanced. 

Blade-Masters are definitely way too strong right now.  Lowering their damage and making the AoE only hit basic units should fix them though.  Nothing more to say about them.

And other then that, Imladris is an incredibly balanced faction in my opinion, maybe leaning on the under-powered side in certain aspects.  Credit to the Edain Team for making the pretty much all the units pretty much perfectly balanced compared to other factions. 

Just a few other things though:

I agree with Sawman that Imladris has the least powerful Spellbook in the game currently.  And that doesn't mean that the Spellbook is outright bad, it's just less good then others. 

-The Hobbit summon is very underwhelming compared to other summons.  They are okay when they switch to Rocks, But either way they so quick to everything.  I think this is the opportunity to add Biblo to Imladris.  Not only could he make this summon better (Maybe with a leadership), but this could be the best way to implement Bilbo into the faction.

-Tom Bombadil dies to quick too everything.  Make him harder to kill and he will be better.

-The Last Alliance is slightly too weak in terms of strength, and goes away way too quickly.  I think giving the summon 1 group of Imladris Archers, which are in the summon if I remember correctly, and doubling the timer will make the Summon much better.

-The Flood just needs to do more damage, or at least have some sort of other effect.

Arwen's last two abilities really need to be changed in my opinion.  Noro Lim, Asfaloth is too similar to Glorfindel's Wind Runner, and Blessed Banner is incredibly underwhelming.  I think Blessed Banner would work much better if it was similar to Eomer's Debuff, but instead of Debuffing, it would place the Banner on the Floor which would Buff/Health your units.

And lastly, I think making Ranger Upgrades only allowed to be bought while Halbarad is nearby is a bit weird and inconvenient.

And that's it.  Great work on the faction so far.

--- Ende Zitat ---

Agree on all points here except that Hobbit Summon is weak. They can DESTROY heroes if you target them with rocks. I definitely think it would be cool to have a Bilbo summon added in to it, but as they stand they are not weak if you use them as a hero killer.

Also, just reading the earlier posts Elendil, you started off against Sawman in a perceivably "sassy" kind of a manner, another term might be know-it-all. It might not have seemed this way to you, not being a native english speaker, but it does read that way for us. That of course still does not justify a rude response, so I'll just say keep it polite for all parties :)

Walküre:

--- Zitat von: Elite KryPtik am  4. Aug 2016, 01:43 ---Also, just reading the earlier posts Elendil, you started off against Sawman in a perceivably "sassy" kind of a manner, another term might be know-it-all. It might not have seemed this way to you, not being a native english speaker, but it does read that way for us. That of course still does not justify a rude response, so I'll just say keep it polite for all parties :)

--- Ende Zitat ---

I personally don't see anything that negative, know-it-all, slightly provocative or harsh in Elendil's response. Of course, heated debates can always take place and 'spice up' the dynamics of the forum a bit, but this is not something forbidden by any rule: that's why I honestly decided not to intervene to calm down the waters a bit (as Moderators are supposed to do). In addition, I would say that Sawman's initial post was not so much a good start to develop a discussion from, given that constructive criticism was not provided other than 'this is the worst...' or 'that is totally worthless'. But I am nonetheless very pleased to see that he took time to illustrate his considerations in better terms (the forum exactly enables anyone to do so).

Also, I regard the whole 'language issue' not relevant too. Yes, we are not all English native speakers, but I'm quite sure that many of us are acquainted enough with forum-related customs and manners to discern the difference between being polite and being rude, and to provide reasonable arguments in our replies (especially, members of the internal staff). If this may ease your concern a bit, I will continue to follow this topic carefully as I do with everyone else (and restore the order in case it were needed)  :)

P.S. I took the liberty to use the spoiler feature for your long quotation, as the rules often recommend.

Elite KryPtik:

--- Zitat von: DieWalküre am  4. Aug 2016, 02:17 ---P.S. I took the liberty to use the spoiler feature for your long quotation, as the rules often recommend.

--- Ende Zitat ---

Thats my bad forgetting to use the quote feature. As for my above post, that was just me explaining why Sawman got a little heated, because from my perspective while reading Elendil's first reply there were a couple points that seemed off. The biggest one being the "Maybe pay a bit more attention ;)" with the inclusion of the winky face sounds very sassy or "know-it-allish" as I said. I was just trying to clarify what might have frustrated Sawman. Regardless I'm quite sure it shall remain civil, no need to worry :)

Amandil7:

--- Zitat von: Sawman am  3. Aug 2016, 19:20 ---nothing wrong with lore masters? Are you mad? let me just STUN your entire army 4 times real quick including heros btw while I slaughter your army, nothing wrong at all am I right?

anyways I probably should elaborate so for the spell book the hobbits for there power point cost don't amount to other 2 point summons such as the hobbits for arnor or the orcs of mount gram for angmar

bombidal could have a little more health, dies pretty quick

last alliance isn't that great for the time that you have them, they just don't get a lot done.

gildors first ability is all he is useful for where as other scouts can be useful late game

the armour buff that Elrond gets was meant to be included when I said he still dies to quick and sure he has more health than Gandalf but Gandalf has abilities to keep enemies away where as Elrond has one to do that and for his whirlwind hes got to be fighting for it to be of any affect

arewen is still bad her heal is the only thing shes got going for her and in case you haven't noticed asfolf is exactly the same as glorfidels mounted ability and how do you think her last ability is good its like a worse version of the old Denethor captain and she has to be level 8 to even use it

--- Ende Zitat ---


I actually agree with most of what you said, Imladris heroes aren't very useful or have as clear defined roles (compared to other factions) and why waste precious resources on them when they die within seconds esp Elrond and a so called Tank like Glorfindel. Gildor is only useful for his first ability, I'd pick Merry/Pippin over him since he dies to goblin creeps.

Loremasters are a menace when fighting the AI, they come in huge numbers and quickly disorient any defense you might have.

As for the Spellbook, I think the first two tier powers are good, the last two are a bit problematic. I usually just go for light of aman, because Bombadil isn't worth his cost and Flying units seem to serve no purpose in this mod. Flood needs more damage against buildings and Last Alliance needs to last longer.

Draco100000:
It is strange no one is complaining about the fact that the Duneadain Camp is the most worth-cost building in the game. I mean, you can recruit ridicolously cheap elites, in a ridicolouysly cheap outpost. ( It should be balanced because standard units cost more)....

Why I should buy any standard unit more than blademasters( Incredible area dmg) and eventually veterans of the Last aliance for doing my game, when I can rush this outpost, with the best defense, healing and very good recruitment rate. I feel weaker the standard recruitment of Imladris and I dont know, i dont feel good having to get an outpost to get my average strenght. All others factions ( except rohan) dont need an outpost to get their usual strenght.


Imladris is a faction that changes a lot the game mechanics, but I thought you would change more the lore masters, this is just like 3.8.1 but with 2 guys dead per battallion, still very very powerfull, combos still being OP and obviously the virtually gg in Lategame with Upgrades, veterans, glorfindel and loremasters is secured.( 1 solution would be consider them as werewolves or ents 1000 cost)


Amazing update but needs some more polishment, i feel imladris as counterpart of Rohan. Rohan strong in early, outpost dependant in Late. Imladris strong in Late, outpost dependant in Early. PD: I dont understand 1 battallion at start.. ( If they would be blademasters it would be fine as strong as they are now  :D)

About heros, well I dont care about them so much ( im not feeling that bad Imladris heros, they are just as weak as all heros) except Gildor, that I find very good.... too good. The song is the best support abilitie I have seen, combined with his tactical vision... Probably this guy  combined with the Imladris feeling in General, is making me loving this Faction more in this version than in the previous one.

 As always great job and keep releaqsing amazing stuff ;)

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